Clint back training with the first team today...

[LordNelson]

It's in the eye of the beholder. Also, McBride pretty much put the kaibosh on the Dempsey refusing to play malarkey.

You can believe who you like but Jol would know.

McBride would know what Dempsey told him.

Which Jol would that be?????

The not in the right frame of mind Jol or the refusing to play Jol or that would be a bit harsh Jol????

I'm still not convinced that this is not a fluency in English problem.

[TonyGilroy]

Jol clearly knows.

It's up to individuals to decide whether or not to believe what he says. His English is plenty good enough.

[Senior Supporter]

It's in the eye of the beholder. Also, McBride pretty much put the kaibosh on the Dempsey refusing to play malarkey.

You can believe who you like but Jol would know.

McBride would know what Dempsey told him.

Which Jol would that be?????

The not in the right frame of mind Jol or the refusing to play Jol or that would be a bit harsh Jol????

I'm still not convinced that this is not a fluency in English problem.

You're putting words into Jol's mouth. He never said Dempsey refused to play. If he backtracked it was on the words Sarah used.

[RidgeRider]

Firstly, lets keep the tone of things respectful and not let it degenerate. Ok?

Lots of good points made and good discussion.

This point has probably already been made but I have read through most of this thread and most everyone's comments and while we all know we don't know everything this does feel like the Mark Schwarzer situation all over again. Different manager but same CEO and Owner. Makes me wonder if Alistair or MAF is the real engineer of the whole situation from a Fulham perspective and Jol is only the mouthpiece in the media without full knowledge of the detailed discussions and master plan by the other two.

Nothing like the Scharwzer situation , Mark was happy at Fulham Arsenal made an unsolicited Bid of £2m, we said no he handed in a transfer request we still said no. Mark made no comments to press or tweets, his agent made no comments or tweets and neither did any member of his family. Mark did not do a Radio interview at the end of the previous season telling everyone he wanted to play CL football and joked about joining Liverpool.  
At every turn this is very different to the Mark situation

Mark was public about his wanting to go to Arsenal and playing champions league football, in fact he didn't play a couple of matches due to this situation if I remember it correctly. I agree there were no tweets though. Not sure how that makes things "nothing like the Schwarzer situation" however I accept you view it differently.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/arsenal/8042192/Mark-Schwarzer-admits-time-is-running-out-for-him-to-complete-Arsenal-move.html

[mhatc]

Firstly, lets keep the tone of things respectful and not let it degenerate. Ok?

Lots of good points made and good discussion.

This point has probably already been made but I have read through most of this thread and most everyone's comments and while we all know we don't know everything this does feel like the Mark Schwarzer situation all over again. Different manager but same CEO and Owner. Makes me wonder if Alistair or MAF is the real engineer of the whole situation from a Fulham perspective and Jol is only the mouthpiece in the media without full knowledge of the detailed discussions and master plan by the other two.

Nothing like the Scharwzer situation , Mark was happy at Fulham Arsenal made an unsolicited Bid of £2m, we said no he handed in a transfer request we still said no. Mark made no comments to press or tweets, his agent made no comments or tweets and neither did any member of his family. Mark did not do a Radio interview at the end of the previous season telling everyone he wanted to play CL football and joked about joining Liverpool.  
At every turn this is very different to the Mark situation

Mark was public about his wanting to go to Arsenal and playing champions league football, in fact he didn't play a couple of matches due to this situation if I remember it correctly. I agree there were no tweets though. Not sure how that makes things "nothing like the Schwarzer situation" however I accept you view it differently.

Exactly. He didn't join the team until September 1 2010.

[HatterDon]

All the gossip in the papers today tells of all the possible clubs interested in Dempsey are interested in other players. They all seem to have dropped him like a wet fish.

And does anyone have any reasons why clubs don't seem to want him?
I have given my tactical reasons before why we are not being trampled down by clubs, just wonder what other people think?
I will say I don't think it has anything to do with him 'being on strike'

Since you clearly know what's going on, could you tell us which clubs you KNOW
have passed on Clint
have enquired about him
have made bids for his services
were turned away by Clint, the club, or BOTH.

As a famous man once said, "Just because everyone is entitled to his own opinion, doesn't mean that he's entitled to his own facts." It's been said many times by many people on all of the 382 threads trashing Dempsey, that nobody knows ANY facts about the situation and, as boring as it may sound, we might want to wait to find out something either from Dempsey or from Fulham before we assess blame or give praise.

And, seeing as how Fulham does its business very quietly and seldom quotes prices of players in or out, I think all we're going to hear is that either:

Clint has signed a contrct extension OR
Clint has been transferred to Arsenal.

Was there ever a poster on the Offal with the handle "Opinionman?"

[Apprentice to the Maestro]

We seem to be getting a bit desperate so resorting to low blows. I used to post mainly (as a polite member) on Cottage Corner. If there was going to be much abuse I rather suspect that it would show up there. People were a bit annoyed but it quickly blew over. Maybe it has been a long-running issue on FOF.

Anyway that was a neat way of avoiding the real points that:

a) in his defence, I don't think Dempsey originally said he wanted to leave
b) the difference between them is that Dembele has said that he is happy to stay and played on Saturday whereas Dempsey has said he wants to leave and didn't play on Saturday.

First, no low blow was intended I was simply pointing out that your point went on a tangent well away from my original comment.  My comment was that many of the posters who have previously criticized Dempsey as being a malcontent for repeatedly stating it was his goal to play Champion's League Football seem to have ho qualms with Dembele for stating that he is using the club as a stepping stone.  I find a bit of ironic humor in the disjunctive thought process.

As for addressing points and not avoiding them, your point b only has merit if the club played no part in sitting Dempsey aside from first team training.  

1. Do you know that the club did not play a part in excluding Dempsey from first team training?  
2. Did the club ever say they did not play a part in excluding Dempsey from first team training?
3. Are you adhering to an opinion that the club did not play any part in Dempsey not being included in first team action.

Which of the three is it?

As for why would the club do that?  Dempsey's contract is an asset to the club.  If he is injured and cannot be traded the club loses out on a payday just as much as Dempsey.  

As for why would Dempsey not comment on the situation press?  Perhaps he is the one trying not to burn his bridges. Perhaps there are misconduct ramifications in his contract if he does.  The only thing that is certain is that assuming Dempsey's silence means the club statement is wholly correct and wholly informative is just an assumption and nothing more.

As for me, I'll leave the speculation to the press and I will take a wait and see approach.  If Dempsey does rejoin the first team after the window closes we are likely not to hear much more about this one way or the other any.  If he does not I am sure we will all get an ear full which some will dispute and others embrace.

Thank you for your careful and detailed response. I hope that I can do it justice.

Yes, posters overlook the contradictions and ironies in their posts.

I have always believed that it is unlikely to be as simple as Dempsey saying "I refuse to play" but, as TonyGilroy ably points out, there are different ways of reaching the same outcome. Yes, the club were almost certainly involved in reaching that outcome but who initiated it? The club?

I don't think the discussion is about whether `the club statement is wholly correct and wholly informative'.
It says that Dempsey is not playing because he thought that Liverpool would be making an offer (which seemed to be confirmed by the Fenway web site gaff) but no offer has be received (which agrees with the Liverpool manager's comment). If those points were wrong you might think we would have heard from one source or another and particularly from Dempsey.

[Cheeky point: aren't your `perhaps's speculation?]

[Mr Fulham]

can't we all [...] agree that dempsey is overrated

No, we can't.

[Patterson]

can't we all [...] agree that dempsey is overrated

No, we can't.

Seriously.  Are we going to start slagging off one of our best ever players before he's even moved on.

Let's all take a deep breath, remember that the press stretches and/or fabricates and wait to see for ourselves.  The one thing I've gleamed from this whole saga is that I hate the sports media.  Hate them for football, hockey, basketball, etc...

Let's all remember this is an ongoing situation and both sides have interest in making themselves look good or the other side look not so good.  How 'bout we take everything with a grain of salt until real news comes forth.  None of this "allegedly" and "let's suppose" business that's been going on.

I don't think of him as gone YET.

[Berserker]

I'm going to lock this thread now as I think it has run it's course and the arguements just keep going round and round in circles