Khan out?

[Fulham76]

I put all the blame on Al Fayed. After the Europa final he failed to rebuild the side as he had already decided to sell the club & get all his money back.
We have not recovered & it will be damn hard to do so now there is the FFP to contend with. There is no way Khan can pump in millions as Fayed did under the new rules.

The above is 100% correct Sir.

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[WayneKerrins]

Facts:
Last summer was net break even transfer spend
No significant investment in Jan and we even tried to offload RUIZ with no replacement
15 plus out, 6 in. More money raised than spent. No new CB, let alone 2, no new DCM. Season starts in 10 days.
Riggs interview focussed on why we lose young players and could lose more and how FFP is such a constraint (even though we have loads of room).

If you believe in Khan fair enough but let's not distort recent history.

[bill taylors apprentice]

I put all the blame on Al Fayed. After the Europa final he failed to rebuild the side as he had already decided to sell the club & get all his money back.
We have not recovered & it will be damn hard to do so now there is the FFP to contend with. There is no way Khan can pump in millions as Fayed did under the new rules.

It interesting how you use a number of half truths to try and make a whole truth and yet still come up with a load of balderdash !

[Fulham76]

I put all the blame on Al Fayed. After the Europa final he failed to rebuild the side as he had already decided to sell the club & get all his money back.
We have not recovered & it will be damn hard to do so now there is the FFP to contend with. There is no way Khan can pump in millions as Fayed did under the new rules.

It interesting how you use a number of half truths to try and make a whole truth and yet still come up with a load of balderdash !

:plus one:

Exactly. I think b*llocks is the technical term for those comments.

[MJG]

I put all the blame on Al Fayed. After the Europa final he failed to rebuild the side as he had already decided to sell the club & get all his money back.
We have not recovered & it will be damn hard to do so now there is the FFP to contend with. There is no way Khan can pump in millions as Fayed did under the new rules.

It interesting how you use a number of half truths to try and make a whole truth and yet still come up with a load of balderdash !

While I would not put all the blame on MAF it is true that he did not put any more money into the club and in fact the club paid back £20m over a three year period (10m in two of the years).
The investment was not there and we basically ran as a sustainable club.. Even tho we were losing money almost every year.
Now with Hughes he wanted a massive jump up in wages and fees paid for players. In his first year our wages went up 17% anyway. So his talk of ambition etc,  while technically true,  does not tell the whole story.

[Lighthouse]

Why is a post from February being dragged up again. I look at the comments I made and they were as accurate as my comments ever have been. But we have been over all this and Khan is still here. Not putting huge amounts of money because of the stupid and crippling purchase of the limping Greek who we can't now get rid of.

So we know who is to blame. Most of the people who were in charge over the past five years. Al for stopping investing and flogging sustainability. Khan for having little or no idea what needed to be done to stop us falling. The MD and Jol for not making the point well enough. Finally the German who was the pantomime villain to match all pantomime villains.

We didn't invest in January which was a mistake but open to argument. Who could we bring in? Now we are left with another rebuilding project. It looks to be going better now. But we will all just have to wait and see. Khan out? Well he was out of his depth but hopefully getting better advice now.

[God The Mechanic]

Facts:
Last summer was net break even transfer spend
No significant investment in Jan and we even tried to offload RUIZ with no replacement
15 plus out, 6 in. More money raised than spent. No new CB, let alone 2, no new DCM. Season starts in 10 days.
Riggs interview focussed on why we lose young players and could lose more and how FFP is such a constraint (even though we have loads of room).

If you believe in Khan fair enough but let's not distort recent history.

If you don't want to distort history then you have to acknowledge that we have made a profit on player sales every year for at least the last 10 - oddly most of those were under MAFs ownership yet Khan is the stingy one.  Hell, in the 2012-13 season we made a £20million profit on selling players.  Yet every year we made huge and ridiculous losses as a club in general - without balancing players coming in and going out we'd be making absolutely ludicrous losses.  Which is something we just CANNOT do.

At the end of MAFs final season our wages were 91% of turnover - again, that HAD to be stopped or we'd be screwed.  MAF may have been preaching sustainability, but we were absolutely haemorrhaging money under his stewardship and had that sort of leadership been in place last season we'd be looking at some heavy fines and possible transfer embargoes this coming season.

[Oakeshott]

"So we know who is to blame"

Yes we do, but not all those you've listed.

MAF did nothing wrong, given his wish to sell. He sold a Premiership team with a clearly ageing squad who had struggled in his final year. Only an ignorant potential purchaser could have failed to realise that to ensure continued Premiership survival would require significant investment.

You blame the MD and Jol for not making that point well enough. We don't, of course, know exactly what AM and Jol advised Khan, but we know Jol's view on the failure to replace Demps and Dembele - he expressed it often enough even while MAF was our owner. It is difficult to believe AM and Jol advised Khan that no significant new investment was necessary and that we were comfortably capable of staying up as we were. If they advised him what was obvious, they can't be sensibly blamed for failing to convince him - what he made of the advice he was given, and his actions in the light of that advice, are solely his responsibility.

Obviously the "pantomime villain" as you term him didn't help, but he was brought in rather late in the day.

To my mind the blame for our demise falls squarely on Khan's shoulders - he didn't inform himself adequately about what he was getting into and (with the exception of getting rid of Jol) made consistently poor decisions in his first year. We will find out soon whether the decisions he has made in his second year prove any better.

No point, of course, in calling "Khan out". As the owner he will stay as long as he wants to whether we like it or not.

[cookieg]

So Khan is a fool for accepting the advice given to him by the people working for MAF - who wanted to sell up and get his money back. Maybe the questions have to be more about the advice given and what was it that convinced Khan to buy us. Anyone could see we were in decline for a couple of years before his purchase. Khan would have known this from just watching MOTD!!

If the advice was somewhat generous in our then current state who authorised this advice to be given? MAF wanted out so may have made things look far more rosier than they were.

Or maybe, just maybe, MAF/AM whoever were completely honest and said we are in a pile of poo and Khan still went ahead and purchased us knowing it would take a long time to rebuild us and is in for the long haul.

If Khan had said sod this and not bought then our demise could well have been terminal and we could be looking forward to Macclesfield away again.

[Nick Bateman]

It is Khan that is to blame for the collapse of the club in the previous 2 seasons. What good has he done for the club? The only advantage is that he has a load of money but he doesn't seen to want to spend it on the club just on the Jaguars. Fine if that's what he wants then sell us up and get someone in who has the club in their best interests like Al Fayed did maybe not with the same amount of money but with heart; the most important thing. He may be getting poorly advised but ultimately it is his final decision and he has adjust and learn more in order to make his own decisions if he is to stay as owner.

An interesting post by the OP and intriguing equally to read the defenders of this bad situation, from "You're a fool" to "This must be a wind-up". Mohamed Al Fayed is still receiving blame for another parties mistakes, after wiping out a £120million debt to ensuring Fulham had a multi-billionaire to take-over his lost interest (because of failure to get a British passport in particular).

Mo could so easily have sold Fulham to another Marler Estates but his heart was still in the right place up to the very end, wearing the black&white scarf whenever he attended, which was far more than Khan.

Khan is to blame for not being aware of the poor advice he received from Ali Mack & Jol and his ergonomically lethargic procrastination in reacting to problems arising.  He took so long to sack "Mad" Magath even Leroy Rosenoir commented on TV about it.  And Ali Mack is STILL in a job, albeit slightly compromised, but in the important position of finalising contracts, HENCE Fulham are barely bringing in anybody despite a relaxation in the fair play rules and Fulham one of the financially better off teams outside of the Premier League.

The last few days I've been wanting to voice my concerns about the general difference in attitude between messers Khan and Fayed.  Mo used to be in charge of the No.1 department store in the world in Harrods; the excellence of quality were the very highest from which Mo took at active part in daily inspections.  His doctrine was applied to Fulham.

Mo demanded excellent standards and did not suffer fools lightly.  He also took a general interest in football, which Khan does not appear to.  Khan could never run a luxury department store like Harrods and we see the amateurish style he has applied to the club we support; we are still playing in the much maligned GREY BAR shirts in our pre-season friendlies!!

I honestly believe Ali Mack is trying to impress the owner with a black bank balance while Fulham's team SUFFER with loanees, freebies and cheap low-cost unwanted signings.  We should have bought Patrick Bamford, we should now get Ashley Barnes.  This is the type of quality we COULD get but are making no effort to do.

The window is closing while the inertia from the board continues and the one to finally carry the blame will be the manager, given a second-rate squad, and not Khan himself!

[GloucesterWhite]

"So we know who is to blame"

Yes we do, but not all those you've listed.

MAF did nothing wrong, given his wish to sell. He sold a Premiership team with a clearly ageing squad who had struggled in his final year. Only an ignorant potential purchaser could have failed to realise that to ensure continued Premiership survival would require significant investment.

You blame the MD and Jol for not making that point well enough. We don't, of course, know exactly what AM and Jol advised Khan, but we know Jol's view on the failure to replace Demps and Dembele - he expressed it often enough even while MAF was our owner. It is difficult to believe AM and Jol advised Khan that no significant new investment was necessary and that we were comfortably capable of staying up as we were. If they advised him what was obvious, they can't be sensibly blamed for failing to convince him - what he made of the advice he was given, and his actions in the light of that advice, are solely his responsibility.

Obviously the "pantomime villain" as you term him didn't help, but he was brought in rather late in the day.

To my mind the blame for our demise falls squarely on Khan's shoulders - he didn't inform himself adequately about what he was getting into and (with the exception of getting rid of Jol) made consistently poor decisions in his first year. We will find out soon whether the decisions he has made in his second year prove any better.

No point, of course, in calling "Khan out". As the owner he will stay as long as he wants to whether we like it or not.

:plus one:

It's called 'due diligence'. Khan was gullible and did not undertake sufficient due dilligence. Had he done so he would have realised the state the team was in and invested heavily when he first took the baton. Had he done so we probably would not have been relegated. He did not do so and the rest as they say is history.

Anyone who thinks Khan is not to blame please answer the above points.

However, we can't turn the clock back and there is no point in calling for Khan to go now. He seems to be getting the hang of it - the appointment of Mike Rigg was a big plus.

[alfie]

Funny how we know all this but Khan, once again it is all speculation unless you/me/anyone were party to negotiations/advice given/received, I just love the way people state things as fact when they don't know for sure.

[Roberty]

It is Khan that is to blame for the collapse of the club in the previous 2 seasons. What good has he done for the club? The only advantage is that he has a load of money but he doesn't seen to want to spend it on the club just on the Jaguars. Fine if that's what he wants then sell us up and get someone in who has the club in their best interests like Al Fayed did maybe not with the same amount of money but with heart; the most important thing. He may be getting poorly advised but ultimately it is his final decision and he has adjust and learn more in order to make his own decisions if he is to stay as owner.

I honestly believe Ali Mack is trying to impress the owner with a black bank balance while Fulham's team SUFFER with loanees, freebies and cheap low-cost unwanted signings.  We should have bought Patrick Bamford, we should now get Ashley Barnes.  This is the type of quality we COULD get but are making no effort to do.

The window is closing while the inertia from the board continues and the one to finally carry the blame will be the manager, given a second-rate squad, and not Khan himself!

You should learn how to search with Google then you will have a chance of getting some / one of your facts right.

Patrick Bamford was not and is not for sale - (according to a scum supporter I know) the scum see him as having a bright future with them; he is on a season long loan to Palace and (according to a Palace supporter I know) this was a coup by Pardew

As it is your have written your usual twaddle (now I am to be banned by a mod  :012: )

[YankeeJim]

Z Z Z Z Z Z
Lets get the season started so we can quit rehashing topics that have been beaten to death.
Does anyone notice how Dempsey falls over a lot?
That Baird is just useless at right back!
Woy's team is just boring to watch.
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[Nick Bateman]

You should learn how to search with Google then you will have a chance of getting some / one of your facts right.

Patrick Bamford was not and is not for sale - (according to a scum supporter I know) the scum see him as having a bright future with them; he is on a season long loan to Palace and (according to a Palace supporter I know) this was a coup by Pardew

As it is your have written your usual twaddle (now I am to be banned by a mod  :012: )

You make some salient points that are credible, and in the long term could turn out to be valid. I can see where you are coming from.
For the record, I am satisfied with all the preseason signings, and I have no objections, they will enhance the team/squad, and we still have enough time to secure the signatures of key quality players.
I feel a lot better about the preseason than in recent seasons, and would rather wait and give all concerned an opportunity to show that we can turn the tide, and make progress, remember, there are 23 other teams who have the same aspirations, so we have to earn it.
Whether you are right in what you say in the short and long term, remains to be seen, but I understand your concerns.
However, I feel this is not the right time to open up any wounds, or allow what has happened in the past fester, as their are so far a half a dozen new players, as well as youth all wanting to play well for the club.
The Manager has been given a clean sheet I presume, and it is his teams and his players this season.
There are a number of people who question Khans intentions and suitability, and I understand why, as I am still to be convinced.
Yes, we all want to see a couple more quality signings, if we want to stand any chance of achieving a top ten place or above.
But this close to the season, is not the best time to have mutiny in the ranks.
As I say, your analysis could end up being correct.
But we are heading into a brand new season, and now is not the time to I don't think to be that negative.

Contrast the manner in which you, Bob, have responded to my fair assessment and the way Mammoth has replied, and one can see a difference in respect and courtesy betwist the two.  Mammoth responds with intelligent, well-founded counter-points which encourage debate, while you, Bob, react antagonisingly irked as if a Fulham fan should not DARE to question the wisdom of those in charge of the club.

As I stated, Bob, which you failed to comprehend, Fulham should have moved for Patrick Bamford; should being a past tense meaning a possibility in the past.  Meaning, Fulham missed an opening to acquire Bamford, at least on loan, as Palace have done, though I contend an offer of around £8-10million we may have tempted the Russian oligarch's hand.  But because YOU have so much faith in how Ali Mack and Khan are running things, Palace have him for the season and Fulham have the same forward line as last season.

Ashley Barnes is still an option as I remarked, and there may be others whom other contributors on this forum rate equally or higher.  The main point being, Khan and those negiotiating the contracts like Mackintosh must show more ambition as Mohamed Al Fayed did when we were in the same spot several years ago.

And I concur with Mammoth, Gloucester White and others that calling for Khan's head is not a starter - it's not as though Khan has done NOTHING!  I simply want better.

[Roberty]

I have faith in player greed and ambition - why on earth would Bamford want to spend another season on loan to a Championship team when his agent has been touting him round the Premier League circuit all summer.

It is nothing to do with the people at our club

All the players - almost from birth - have agents - they are the ones who ultimately decide who it going to play where and they are the ones who are paid to do the rounds and find best options for their client

As for Ashley Barnes:-

The Burnley striker Ashley Barnes will miss the majority of next season after suffering a serious knee injury. The 25-year-old sustained anterior cruciate ligament and medial collateral ligament damage in Sunday's final-day Premier League victory over Aston Villa. He will undergo surgery next week. (27 May 2015 - Guardian)

I don't expect you to buy the Guardian and read it but if you Google him you will find that most news organisations carried the story

Did you think that buying the injured Mitro was a good idea as well?

My itch with you is the total lack of research that goes into your output on here and if you take out the factual inaccuracies there is very little substance left

[Ron91]

What a joke topic! Guy has shown ambition and whilst its not going right just yet he wants the club exactly where i want to see us back in the PL!!

[WayneKerrins]

What a joke topic! Guy has shown ambition and whilst its not going right just yet he wants the club exactly where i want to see us back in the PL!!

No net positive spend on transfers since relegation = ambition.

Billionaire with parachute payments and £13m of FFP losses to use as relative advantage on 20 or so of our champ competition and we have same CBS (minus the best Turner), no CDM and a huge f.cking transfer surplus.

15 out and 6 in.

And you have the gall to call this a show of ambition? Jesus wept..

[Forever Fulham]

Who wiped out the 120 million in debt?  Was it Khan or MAF?  I should know this but I've forgotten.  I thought it was Khan who pulled out his checkbook (chequebook) and cleared the debt off the books.  No?  Those pointing the finger at Khan in this post have minimized (or is it trivialized) the acts of others upon whom Khan so rightfully relied.  Khan has splashed the cash.  Yet somehow some stink sticks to him because others spent it poorly, or because they gave him bad advice.   Who clears the acquisition of a player like Mitroglou for that kind of money without doing a proper physical?  For shame!  On paper, did Magath look like a poor choice?  Of course not.  Winner of the Bundesliga.  The great turnaround specialist who had never before failed to save a team from the brink.  And what about Rene--the people's choice.  SAF's right hand man for how many years?  Does ManU suffer fools or incompetents?  No.  You can go down the history of how we got to here.  A lot of bad luck.  Some injuries.  Some employees who let him down.  Some managers that weren't suited for the Prem or full Fulham at the time of their respective appointments.  Friends, Romans, Fulhamites!  Don't let Shad Khan be your whipping boy.  Your lightning rod of unhappiness.  He did what a good foreign owner should do.  He opened up his wallet when asked, and he deferred to the team on the ground, with the pedigree and the titles to which one would normally defer.  Had he hovered about, had he been ever-present, pacing the line and gesticulating wildly, you would have feared the Meddling American and resented him for it.   He can't win.  The game is rigged.  He does X, you blame him.  He doesn't do X, you still blame him.  An easy scapegoat.  When did Khan stop beating his wife?  Give it a rest.  He's quality.  Some things you can't fake.  Just ask the fans who have spent time with him.  He wants to do the right thing.  He got bad advice, and the occasional poor discharge  of duty by staff.  He hasn't left.  He hasn't sold.  He is trying to right the ship.  Once burned on wildly misspent money, twice shy.  Where is it written that he should shell out like Abramovich?  He strikes me as a man of action who makes decisive moves, learns from the past, and pivots.  We'd be a fool to underestimate his intelligence and his strengths.  What is Riggs but a reflection of reacting in positive way to what he's learned from past experience?   

[God The Mechanic]

According to Transfermarkt we made a profit of £300k on transfers last summer.  This season we have made a £2.3million profit and the window hasn't closed yet.  You have no idea what's going on behind the scenes, but everything Khan has done so far suggests he is willing to spend money having spent around £10million on players in 3 of his 4 transfer windows in charge - including spending £20million without generating anything of note in his first season in charge.

Also, spending doesn't automatically mean getting value and quality.

Ignoring transfers in and out, as a club we are a massively loss making business.  Based on previous years I fully believe we will be close to the FFP limit when last season's accounts are produced, so the fact HE as a person is a billionaire doesn't mean a single thing as WE as a club do not generate the income needed.

Things aren't like they were in MAFs early years.