Fulham have known for some time that they were willing to sell McCormack ...

[Apprentice to the Maestro]

How many times do we have to go round this.  People making statements as though they are facts.  One fact we do know is that we don't know the real facts.

You can have an opinion, but that is all it is, and you could be totally wrong.

If McCormack stays, great, if he goes, we move on and make the best of it by using the money to good effect.  I remember selling the horse and buying Saha, that worked out ok.

I don't quite get where you're coming from with this? The OP, incuding myself, have never claimed to state 'facts' we've just given our opinion(s). If you want to argue that Jokanovic never claimed he wanted to build a team around Ross, then so be it, because he clearly did. If you want to argue that Khan never said 'he'll do what it takes' then fine, because again, he clearly did.

Like anything on this forum, you give an 'opinion' and you're instantly jumped on from a great height by those who want you to either a) prove the 'facts', or b) bring you down because your trying to claim 'facts' - you can't win.

Now, let's see if the usual mob will jump on this and pick the bones out of it, because they will.

"Bottom line is, the Club has told Jokanovic that he must sell Ross to release funds to buy other players, and I don't think this become apparent until quite recently"

comes across as stating a fact rather than merely offering an opinion.

Annnnd right on Q..

Well you do leave yourself wide open for it don't you.

You studiously point to the two facts you used to try to make your claim of innocence but disingenuously skip over that wild piece of speculation.

Not really, no. Like I've stated before, please point out where I, or even the OP has stated 'facts' because we haven't. As per usual, you're just an argumentative individual, be it with me, or anyone else on this forum, if you don't like their opinion. Grow up.

The original poster has just stated things as facts which are clearly not.

I am not saying that you have stated facts. Opinions though such as "Bottom line is, the Club has told Jokanovic that he must sell Ross to release funds to buy other players, and I don't think this become apparent until quite recently" come across so strongly as though they could not possibly be doubted.

And my earlier point is that you used the two facts to justify your position but omitted the above opinion still stands.

Given that the first two statements are facts what in your writing tells us that that you are putting forward your third point as an opinion rather than another fact?

Opinions as well as facts can and should be supported by evidence and a sound line of argument.

I am not arguing against your opinion (yet).

I am asking that those who have forthright opinions try to support them with facts and a reasonable line of thinking so that we can engage with them rather than feeling we are dumb pupils being shouted at by an angry teacher.

[snarks]

Fact - club keen to offload Ross for the right money.
Fact - if there had been a desire from Fulham to keep Ross he would have stayed and seen out his contract.

No - if someone offers the clubs valuation they will sell him. Not keen otherwise he would have gone already
No - his contracts been upgraded twice IIRC how much more can they offer.

Neither of your facts are facts they are your perceptions and or opinions

[toshes mate]

How many times do we have to go round this.  People making statements as though they are facts.  One fact we do know is that we don't know the real facts.

You can have an opinion, but that is all it is, and you could be totally wrong.

If McCormack stays, great, if he goes, we move on and make the best of it by using the money to good effect.  I remember selling the horse and buying Saha, that worked out ok.

Have to say this is the most accurate way of assessing where the situation is at and nobody on here really knows any better factually.  On another thread there is the description of Jokanovic and a fan's post selfie question about McCormack's future for which the boss says nothing but pats the fan on the back.  That, in my opinion, is the bosses way of saying  'your guess is as good as mine'.   How can Jokanovic be sure of McCormack's future when there is a release clause in his contract and still six weeks to run in the transfer window?  The pressure is upon the boss to deliver a team that works with or without McCormack just as it would be for any key player who may get injured, suspended or transferred out.  I think we should be a bit more trusting that Jokanovic knows his responsibility to the Club and fans inside out and will deliver the goods with or without certain names on the team sheet.

[alexmur]

How many times do we have to go round this.  People making statements as though they are facts.  One fact we do know is that we don't know the real facts.

You can have an opinion, but that is all it is, and you could be totally wrong.

If McCormack stays, great, if he goes, we move on and make the best of it by using the money to good effect.  I remember selling the horse and buying Saha, that worked out ok.

well said sir

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[Carborundum]

How many times do we have to go round this.  People making statements as though they are facts.  One fact we do know is that we don't know the real facts.

You can have an opinion, but that is all it is, and you could be totally wrong.

If McCormack stays, great, if he goes, we move on and make the best of it by using the money to good effect.  I remember selling the horse and buying Saha, that worked out ok.

Have to say this is the most accurate way of assessing where the situation is at and nobody on here really knows any better factually.  On another thread there is the description of Jokanovic and a fan's post selfie question about McCormack's future for which the boss says nothing but pats the fan on the back.  That, in my opinion, is the bosses way of saying  'your guess is as good as mine'.   How can Jokanovic be sure of McCormack's future when there is a release clause in his contract and still six weeks to run in the transfer window?  The pressure is upon the boss to deliver a team that works with or without McCormack just as it would be for any key player who may get injured, suspended or transferred out.  I think we should be a bit more trusting that Jokanovic knows his responsibility to the Club and fans inside out and will deliver the goods with or without certain names on the team sheet.

Wise words.  Whilst I'm sure any self-motivated person would feel the pressure right now in SJ's shoes, he shouldn't be feeling it alone.  Come 1 September we will all be able to judge whether the green light to build a team capable of promotion was accompanied by sufficient petrol in the tank.  Some bought season tickets on the strength of our owner's pledge.

At the point pen hit paper on the contract, Fulham have known they are obliged to sell RMcC if certain conditions are met.  But also obliged to keep him if those conditions are not.  SJ's teams in preseason have been a pragmatic exercise in planning for the worst, irrespective of RMcC's injury.

Frankly the most realistic way a club in our position could avoid this uncertainty would be to not bother having a player of RMcC's quality on the books.

[RaySmith]

The club doesn't want to sell him - if only because of Joka's concerns- but this does show ambition on the part of the club.

he is for sale at an offer we can't refuse price, though, which seems fair enough, considering our situation, when such money could buy a few new players.

I only think it good to keep Ross, whatever style we play. Such a quality player, who can play in different positions can only be good to have, surely? He can adapt I would think.

[Lewes White]

Ross Ross Ross bloody McCormack, hasn't anyone noticed we seem to be ok without him, move on!!!!!!

[Twig]

Fulham have known for some time that they were willing to sell McCormack and that they were losing Dembele

Bottom line is, the Club has told Jokanovic that he must sell Ross to release funds to buy other players

Agree with those saying the foregoing are (wrongly) expressed as fact

Me too.  This is opinion being misrepresented as fact.

[toshes mate]

Wise words.  Whilst I'm sure any self-motivated person would feel the pressure right now in SJ's shoes, he shouldn't be feeling it alone.  Come 1 September we will all be able to judge whether the green light to build a team capable of promotion was accompanied by sufficient petrol in the tank.  Some bought season tickets on the strength of our owner's pledge.

At the point pen hit paper on the contract, Fulham have known they are obliged to sell RMcC if certain conditions are met.  But also obliged to keep him if those conditions are not.  SJ's teams in preseason have been a pragmatic exercise in planning for the worst, irrespective of RMcC's injury.

Frankly the most realistic way a club in our position could avoid this uncertainty would be to not bother having a player of RMcC's quality on the books.

And wise words from you too.  We really do need to see the positives at Fulham rather than the negatives. We have a man in charge who certainly seems to know what he is doing and needs our wholehearted support whatever may happen that is beyond his control.  For my money he is doing and saying all the right things and a lot of it is being translated to good results from the players.  This is a new season and we should reserve judgement as to the team's performances until the transfer window is over and we have seen how the team performs in competitive matches.  I have always believed that October is the month when you get the feel of where a team is really going and I am as certain as I can be that we will all be a lot happier with things than we were at the same time last year.   And I am not going to let the bitching about things we cannot control dent my optimism.

[MJG]

The question of selling to a rival is like this for me.

Do i think Norwich will be in top six without Ross?...Yes

Do i thinking selling him to Norwich make any difference to their season?..I dont think it will have that much of a dramatic one.

Does selling Ross to Norwich have any affect on us with regards Norwich possibly taking a place in top six we are after?...No because of answers to the first two questions.

[JoelH5]

The question of selling to a rival is like this for me.

Do i think Norwich will be in top six without Ross?...Yes

Do i thinking selling him to Norwich make any difference to their season?..I dont think it will have that much of a dramatic one.

Does selling Ross to Norwich have any affect on us with regards Norwich possibly taking a place in top six we are after?...No because of answers to the first two questions.

Agree but... I think it would have a dramatic difference. He's proven in this league. Think what he can do with better service!?

Still, we dont have much choice and with the 6.8 mil reported for Mitrog.. and 12m for Ross, in regards to FFP, we're almost £19m up!

[Wearethewhites]

Fulham have known for some time that they were willing to sell McCormack and that they were losing Dembele

Bottom line is, the Club has told Jokanovic that he must sell Ross to release funds to buy other players

Agree with those saying the foregoing are (wrongly) expressed as fact

Me too.  This is opinion being misrepresented as fact.

Of course it would, because as soon as people like Apprentice to the Maestro and Statto jump on the wagon with their 'stats and facts', their band of merry men chose to follow.

As explained, please point out where I've stated this was an actual fact, and I'll then agree that you have a point, but you haven't.

Going down the routes of 'misrepresented as facts' just because you can't find a fact, doesn't count either.

[..FOF..]

McCormack apparently had a new £15 Million buyout clause added to an updated deal when he put pen to paper in January.

http://www.getwestlondon.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/fulham-tell-norwich-how-much-11688993

So, I believe they knew for some time that as long as someone willing to offer that amount, he is unlikely to go anywhere.

Rigg is probably going to keep on ignoring everybody while he work on signing the next Odoi, Aluko, McDonald, etc  :047:

...and if someone offered 15million, well, that was what they agreed upon in January right?

[Twig]

Fulham have known for some time that they were willing to sell McCormack and that they were losing Dembele

Bottom line is, the Club has told Jokanovic that he must sell Ross to release funds to buy other players

Agree with those saying the foregoing are (wrongly) expressed as fact

Me too.  This is opinion being misrepresented as fact.

Of course it would, because as soon as people like Apprentice to the Maestro and Statto jump on the wagon with their 'stats and facts', their band of merry men chose to follow.

As explained, please point out where I've stated this was an actual fact, and I'll then agree that you have a point, but you haven't.

Going down the routes of 'misrepresented as facts' just because you can't find a fact, doesn't count either.

OP "Fulham have known for some time....." This is a statement of alleged fact.  There is no use of the conditional, no "in my opinion", no "if Fulham have known....." etc. So a statement of alleged fact.

In addition Howitis claimed;
Fact - club keen to offload Ross for the right money.
Fact - if there had been a desire from Fulham to keep Ross he would have stayed and seen out his contract.

Again opinion masquerading as fact.

I have no problem with people having strong opinions but pretending to have access to factual information? Please do me a favour.

[Jimmy Hill]

Look his transfer is part of a chain, like moving house once everyone is happy contracts will be exchanged on the same day as  we get a new striker. The frustration is that its taking so long which could be our fault or another club in the chain. The question is do you play him on Friday and risk injury? I personally wouldn't if the deal is likely to go through.

[Wearethewhites]

Fulham have known for some time that they were willing to sell McCormack and that they were losing Dembele

Bottom line is, the Club has told Jokanovic that he must sell Ross to release funds to buy other players

Agree with those saying the foregoing are (wrongly) expressed as fact

Me too.  This is opinion being misrepresented as fact.

Of course it would, because as soon as people like Apprentice to the Maestro and Statto jump on the wagon with their 'stats and facts', their band of merry men chose to follow.

As explained, please point out where I've stated this was an actual fact, and I'll then agree that you have a point, but you haven't.

Going down the routes of 'misrepresented as facts' just because you can't find a fact, doesn't count either.

OP "Fulham have known for some time....." This is a statement of alleged fact.  There is no use of the conditional, no "in my opinion", no "if Fulham have known....." etc. So a statement of alleged fact.

In addition Howitis claimed;
Fact - club keen to offload Ross for the right money.
Fact - if there had been a desire from Fulham to keep Ross he would have stayed and seen out his contract.

Again opinion masquerading as fact.

I have no problem with people having strong opinions but pretending to have access to factual information? Please do me a favour.

Pretending? You're now typing like you know anything about certain people on this forum, which funnily enough you don't, and don't know if they're in the know or not - bore off.

[Apprentice to the Maestro]

"Fulham have known for some time that they were willing to sell McCormack ..."

We are in danger, if not already there, of making too much of this. All clubs are willing to sell any player if offered enough money. £100m buys you Pogba, £15m buys you Ross, a set of training kits buys you - who was that?

Having a player sign a buyout clause just means that the player and the buying club know that there is not to be any messing about from either if the selling club enforce the buyout clause.

McCormack is our star player and probably the star player in the Championship last season. It is inevitable that there will be transfer speculation and the likelyhood of bids. The club have put a price on his head to help protect themselves and manage that speculation and bids.

[fulhamben]

Fact....as defined in the English Oxford Collins Dictionary is .....An issue that is indisputably the case. An actuality, truth and reality.
Something that actually exists.

so its not a fact that smith is a good striker then ;)

[fulhamben]

Fact....as defined in the English Oxford Collins Dictionary is .....An issue that is indisputably the case. An actuality, truth and reality.
Something that actually exists.

so its not a fact that smith is a good striker then ;)

Maybe but he scores goals, when he is given the opportunity, any kind of goal, which can be useful over what will be a challenging season.  ⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️ He actually scored again on Saturday, in case you hadn't noticed, but you never acknowledged it, so I assume your weren't in attendance, and if you were in attendance, you weren't paying attention again. 

no no no. I thought he's two yard tap in was the best thing he has done in his two year tenure here. Credit where it's due.

[Mince n Tatties]

Ross and Delia just seen entering the Great British
Bake Off Tent...."Lets be havin yeh"