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[FulhamStu]

Last few season, KMac and StefJo have been amoungst our best players.  The step up to the Premier League looks to me, like a step too big for them.   Seri and Zambo looked good together for the final 30 minutes although I think Watford had by then blown themselves out a bit.  I wonder how Cairney fits in but I guess Slav will play him with Frank and Seri eventually.   Ayité may not be the greatest player but he did improve the shape of the team and Vietto on the other wing looks dangerous with his pace.

Clearly the defence is a major problem, but when you lose the midfield like we did first half it makes defending even harder.   I still say we need time to sort things out but from yesterday, I would like to play a 4-4-2 with Schürrle and Mitro up front and a midfield 4 of Sess, Frank, Seri and Vietto or Christie.  Bring Bryan back at left back and stick with a central defensive partnership for a few games.  I am sure Mawson will come good but he looks what he is, a player who has had a serious injury and missed close season.  It will take him longer to get match ready, how he does that without playing I am not sure.   Odoi has amazed me, he looked excellent 2nd half and it will be difficult to leave him on the bench next game.

[Facts Not Fiction]

Last few season, KMac and StefJo have been amoungst our best players.  The step up to the Premier League looks to me, like a step too big for them.   Seri and Zambo looked good together for the final 30 minutes although I think Watford had by then blown themselves out a bit.  I wonder how Cairney fits in but I guess Slav will play him with Frank and Seri eventually.   Ayité may not be the greatest player but he did improve the shape of the team and Vietto on the other wing looks dangerous with his pace.

Clearly the defence is a major problem, but when you lose the midfield like we did first half it makes defending even harder.   I still say we need time to sort things out but from yesterday, I would like to play a 4-4-2 with Schürrle and Mitro up front and a midfield 4 of Sess, Frank, Seri and Vietto or Christie.  Bring Bryan back at left back and stick with a central defensive partnership for a few games.  I am sure Mawson will come good but he looks what he is, a player who has had a serious injury and missed close season.  It will take him longer to get match ready, how he does that without playing I am not sure.   Odoi has amazed me, he looked excellent 2nd half and it will be difficult to leave him on the bench next game.

Agree completely.

It's a harsh truth, but McDonald is not mobile enough, and Johansen isn't creative enough with the ball.

[bobbo]

Yep Stu OP is spot on.it saddens me to agree because those players along with the rest of the squad continuously gave us all that great feel good factor last season. But in the years we've been out of the prem league everything has moved up several gears. To be honest it's shocked me how fierce it is. I honestly thought we'd cope even with last years squad but sadly no.

[grandad]

Totally agree Stu. It is time to move on with regards to McDonald & Johansen. They were pivotal for us last season but they just don´t have that special PL quality. Good players for our squad but as we saw yesterday they have now to be looking at being on the bench at most.
I know Slavisa loves his 4-3-3 but I feel the same as Stu that a change to 4-4-2 with the players mentioned is the way forward.

[Fulham 442]

Yes I agree with you Stu.  A sad fact but very true.  Out of interest who took the Captain's armband when KMac was subbed?

[snarks]

Slightly disagree, SteffJo was much better when Kmac went of and he was playing the holding midfielder role, I also thought Jok went for a bit more of a 442 style as vietto played deeper and interchanged with floyd who was definitely helping Sess more. Kmac is competent enough on the ball, but hasn't adjusted to the pace yet.

[Tabby]

Slightly disagree, SteffJo was much better when Kmac went of and he was playing the holding midfielder role, I also thought Jok went for a bit more of a 442 style as vietto played deeper and interchanged with floyd who was definitely helping Sess more. Kmac is competent enough on the ball, but hasn't adjusted to the pace yet.

It was a 4-2-3-1 system if anything.

But Johansen did a lot better in second half. Kmac was ineffectual as a holding midfielder, got caught between their midfield and strikers and wasn't quick enough to stay with their midfielders when they went past him.

[toshes mate]

Although much can be said as to the accuracy of FulhamStu's OP, there is the underlying truth that if the defence leaks goals right at the start then the midfield is immediately under pressure to limit damage and I saw little of the control necessary from the whole side to get back into the game.  We allowed Watford to dictate terms from the start and that has happened in quite a few games this season.  Why is the expensive question.  We need to play our own game and not get suckered into what the opposition game plan amounts to.  Our 'stars' from last season haven't suddenly become no-hopers just because they are playing in a higher league.  The classic case is Denis Odoi who manages to stamp his mark on a game no matter what - that is confidence.  Young Ryan is also improving in leaps and bounds without being sensationally good in the manner of his goal scoring feats last season.  He too is holding to his own trade mark. 

The problem is when you mix it all together as a team and that is what appears to devalue certain individuals because others are not doing what is asked of them.  We all knew it would be a tough ask for any eleven selected by SJ to perform to the level to get results in at least three of the games we have played and it was only against Palace that I believe we didn't put together a fair display.  For the other games our performances have been dictated by giving the ball away far too casually in dangerous areas of the pitch and that is not a new habit and we have seen it before from SJ's teams.  I also know he has resolved it before and he will do so again then we may see just how some 'stars' from last season really do stack up to the requirements of this league.   I don't think Denis will be the only player from last season to prove he can step up to the mark.

[FulhamStu]

Although much can be said as to the accuracy of FulhamStu's OP, there is the underlying truth that if the defence leaks goals right at the start then the midfield is immediately under pressure to limit damage and I saw little of the control necessary from the whole side to get back into the game.  We allowed Watford to dictate terms from the start and that has happened in quite a few games this season.  Why is the expensive question.  We need to play our own game and not get suckered into what the opposition game plan amounts to.  Our 'stars' from last season haven't suddenly become no-hopers just because they are playing in a higher league.  The classic case is Denis Odoi who manages to stamp his mark on a game no matter what - that is confidence.  Young Ryan is also improving in leaps and bounds without being sensationally good in the manner of his goal scoring feats last season.  He too is holding to his own trade mark. 

The problem is when you mix it all together as a team and that is what appears to devalue certain individuals because others are not doing what is asked of them.  We all knew it would be a tough ask for any eleven selected by SJ to perform to the level to get results in at least three of the games we have played and it was only against Palace that I believe we didn't put together a fair display.  For the other games our performances have been dictated by giving the ball away far too casually in dangerous areas of the pitch and that is not a new habit and we have seen it before from SJ's teams.  I also know he has resolved it before and he will do so again then we may see just how some 'stars' from last season really do stack up to the requirements of this league.   I don't think Denis will be the only player from last season to prove he can step up to the mark.

I am certainly not suggesting StefJo and KMac are no hopers, and do agree Sess is continually improving and made it clear Odoi was excellent yesterday.  I just feel that the step up for our midfield 3 of last season is too big.   If you have the quality of Man City, you can play 4-3-3 however I think it's too big an ask and I really liked Frank and Seri together yesterday.  4-4-2 gives us more bodies in midfield and feel that would help us, plus I don't think we can expect the full backs to play like wingers as I exposes our weak central defence far too much.   I also agree it's very early days and have repeatedly said Slav will need till Xmas to really sort things out.  There were good signs 2nd half yesterday and in other games this season.  I am sure we will do ok this season but feel Slav may need to change the set up to help the team get established.

[Luka]

The increased speed, power and technical ability required for the PL has impressed me so far.
But what has been the biggest surprise is just how much mental agility the good PL players have. They anticipate more, see things developing sooner and react to situations very very quickly.
We haven't adjusted to the mental side of the PL yet.
Unfortunately some of last seasons heroes won't be able to!!

[@jolslover]

Totally agree Stu. It is time to move on with regards to McDonald & Johansen. They were pivotal for us last season but they just don´t have that special PL quality. Good players for our squad but as we saw yesterday they have now to be looking at being on the bench at most.
I know Slavisa loves his 4-3-3 but I feel the same as Stu that a change to 4-4-2 with the players mentioned is the way forward.

Agree re Johansen + KMAC

[toshes mate]

I am certainly not suggesting StefJo and KMac are no hopers, and do agree Sess is continually improving and made it clear Odoi was excellent yesterday.  I just feel that the step up for our midfield 3 of last season is too big.   If you have the quality of Man City, you can play 4-3-3 however I think it's too big an ask and I really liked Frank and Seri together yesterday.  4-4-2 gives us more bodies in midfield and feel that would help us, plus I don't think we can expect the full backs to play like wingers as I exposes our weak central defence far too much.   I also agree it's very early days and have repeatedly said Slav will need till Xmas to really sort things out.  There were good signs 2nd half yesterday and in other games this season.  I am sure we will do ok this season but feel Slav may need to change the set up to help the team get established.

I agree with much of your observation in both the OP and the follow up above, but, as the saying goes, looks can deceive, and any which way.  There are players who had good overall performances but have also contributed to the errors that have lead to our goals against column simply by being too casual at critical moments.  I remember a certain Mr Ream, not to mention a certain Mr Odoi, to name but two, who have also been 'too casual', and yet as overall talismans  of better things the players who have done the necessary are also guilty of bad moments or even bad games from time to time.  I just loathe the process of devaluing the worth of anyone based on their 'bad ass decisions' when other players are not doing their bit elsewhere either.  I would name a culprit I got very lathered about yesterday but I feel it would be unfair to do so because it is a team game and certain people didn't do their bit at crucial moments which lead to others coming under pressure they barely coped with.

Having said all that I still hang on to the simple fact that Mitro could have had a hat-trick.  It's a funny old game that allows us to muse over what might have been had those headers of his been inches lower.     

[CincyFulham1]

Yes I agree with you Stu.  A sad fact but very true.  Out of interest who took the Captain's armband when KMac was subbed?

Betts

[Camel Club]

Whilst SJ is still deciding on his best back 4 it's clear that the defence needs more protection than that afforded by playing 4-3-3. Whether he goes 4-4-2 or 4-2-3-1, which I would prefer, he must acknowledge that if we continue shipping goals of the nature we saw yesterday his approach, which at the moment is considered bold, will start to be described as cavalier and naive.

Separately whilst I agree with the general comments regarding KMac and Stef Jo, Kmac would be far better as one of two central/holding midfielders and Stef Jo in a 3 ahead of a 2 at this level.

[filham]

KMac spent most of the first half yesterday playing in the back four as an extra centre back, had he not done we would have been more than a goal down at half time.  Watford were all over us and our back four were at breaking point.

It is worth a look at last season's line up and to ask ourselves where the 100 million pounds worth of improvement have been made.

Last Season:-
                                                Betts
                    Fredericks       Odoi          Ream       Targett

                                                MacDonald

                               Johansen                    Cairney   


         Kamara                                                                   Sess.

                                         Mitro


Yesterday:-

                                                      Betts

                       Mensah            Mawson       Chambers       Sess.

                                                      Mac Donald

                               Seri                                              Johansen

                   Shurlle                            Mitro                                  Vietto

The only new players worthy of disturbing that popular team from last season were Seri and possibly Sherlle, quite honestly none of the other signings have justified the money we spent on them.

We have to be grateful for spending such a large sum on retaining Mitro for without him we wouold be in dire trouble, while our defense is all at sea our attacker ,other than Mitro, are not scoring goals too frequently.

[snarks]

Don't forget Mitro is now permanent and the was expensive enough. I would also have preferred MLM to Chambers at LCB if those three had been playing that's over 1/2 of the money expended.

[gang]

I also agree some players are just not up to standard.
The one thing I liked about Ferguson was his ability to note when players no longer perform and I believe we should do the same with some of last years stars.

[Pud]

Our defence improved markedly at HT when Odoi was introduced. He may have a mistake in him from time to time but he has a confidence about him that others seem to lack.

[Twig]

KMac spent most of the first half yesterday playing in the back four as an extra centre back, had he not done we would have been more than a goal down at half time.  Watford were all over us and our back four were at breaking point.

It is worth a look at last season's line up and to ask ourselves where the 100 million pounds worth of improvement have been made.

Last Season:-
                                                Betts
                    Fredericks       Odoi          Ream       Targett

                                                MacDonald

                               Johansen                    Cairney   


         Kamara                                                                   Sess.

                                         Mitro


Yesterday:-

                                                      Betts

                       Mensah            Mawson       Chambers       Sess.

                                                      Mac Donald

                               Seri                                              Johansen

                   Shurlle                            Mitro                                  Vietto

The only new players worthy of disturbing that popular team from last season were Seri and possibly Sherlle, quite honestly none of the other signings have justified the money we spent on them.

We have to be grateful for spending such a large sum on retaining Mitro for without him we wouold be in dire trouble, while our defense is all at sea our attacker ,other than Mitro, are not scoring goals too frequently.

Sorry but Vietto looked very decent yesterday.  I also would not write off Mawson, yes, he had a poor game yesterday but he looked what he is; a player coming back from a nasty injury.  Also. as a sub Anguissa made a difference and if he can improve his stamina I think he will be a starter.

[FulhamStu]

KMac spent most of the first half yesterday playing in the back four as an extra centre back, had he not done we would have been more than a goal down at half time.  Watford were all over us and our back four were at breaking point.

It is worth a look at last season's line up and to ask ourselves where the 100 million pounds worth of improvement have been made.

Last Season:-
                                                Betts
                    Fredericks       Odoi          Ream       Targett

                                                MacDonald

                               Johansen                    Cairney   


         Kamara                                                                   Sess.

                                         Mitro


Yesterday:-

                                                      Betts

                       Mensah            Mawson       Chambers       Sess.

                                                      Mac Donald

                               Seri                                              Johansen

                   Shurlle                            Mitro                                  Vietto

The only new players worthy of disturbing that popular team from last season were Seri and possibly Sherlle, quite honestly none of the other signings have justified the money we spent on them.

We have to be grateful for spending such a large sum on retaining Mitro for without him we wouold be in dire trouble, while our defense is all at sea our attacker ,other than Mitro, are not scoring goals too frequently.

But we had so many loans last season...Bryan and Frank are going to be very good for us.  Seri outstanding and Mitro is vital.   I think Vietto is a big upgrade and still expect Mawson to come good.  Max is a very good squad player and Mensa and Shurlle important loans.  I am really only currently unhappy with the signing of Fabri and Chambers, the rest seem pretty good to me.   Last seasons team would not survive in the Premier League but I think our current squad is just about good enough and will improve.

I repeat that whilst I would like Slav to re-think the 4-3-3 set up, I think he needs until Xmas to get things fully in shape, in the meantime, keep picking up some points then push on 2nd half of the season.