Will Brentford's red card be rescinded?

[General]

Henry went in uncontrolled and at a pace that with his foot up suggested to me that it was dangerous and uncontrolled and subsequently deserving of a red.. yes he didn't get the man with his foot, more his body took the player out, but I thought you couldn't go in that wrecklessly and the idea of the red it to warn players not to go in with studs showing as those can put an end to players careers if they're on the receiving end.

That being said though, Brentford are appealing and everyone seems to think it'll be rescinded? Have I missed something?

[fulhamben]

Was a superb tackle imo and should be rescinded (but hopefully it doesn't) it was one footed, he didn't leave the ground. His foot was never above the height of the football and as to studs showing, his foot was below 90  degrees, it's impossible to slide tackle without your studs showing or they would dig in the ground and snap your ankle in half.

[The Rational Fan]

I thought the Swansea player was going to get there first, but that would have ended his career. In the end, the Cardiff player lacked the pace at the last moment and Brentford player got the ball first.

I don't know if the Swansea player did not run fast enough out fear of losing his leg or just his lack of pace. I think it's dangerous to assume the Swansea Player didn't get there first because of his lack of pace, because if he has the pace he only has two options lose the ball or lose his leg.

The collarary of this is not punishing the Brentford player means dangerous players will win the majority of their tackles at the price of a few reds, a trade off many teams would be gladly willing to make.

Glad it was a Red Card, these kind of tackles need to stop especially if the Swansea player could have made it but slowed down going into the tackle to avoid injury.

England has no chance of winning a world cup, if it cannot redice the injury rate of its talented players. If not for injury Micah Richards would be our number one centre back now, Phil Jones would be in the squad, Luke Shaw would be yet to peak, Jack Wilshire would be our best midfielder, Theo Walcott would have peaked last world cup, Harry Kane would be a lot more useful player and Joe Hart would be peaking too. That's a lot stronger squad, England are always half dozen players short of great 23 man squad, normally two injuried for the cup, two that aren't their best and another two that fell apart early 20s.

[rebel]

Henry went in uncontrolled and at a pace that with his foot up suggested to me that it was dangerous and uncontrolled and subsequently deserving of a red.. yes he didn't get the man with his foot, more his body took the player out, but I thought you couldn't go in that wrecklessly and the idea of the red it to warn players not to go in with studs showing as those can put an end to players careers if they're on the receiving end.

That being said though, Brentford are appealing and everyone seems to think it'll be rescinded? Have I missed something?

It was 'two footed', yes he got the ball, he also got the man. On another day he might have got the man, and the player ends up with a career ending injury. I don't think it will be turned over. It probably looks worse then it actually was, but that doesn't change the fact that it was dangerous. 

[keithh]

I thought it was a red card & that Swansea player Brewster was unlucky to be booked for simulation as I thought the Brentford goalkeeper Raya caught him; should have had VAR.

[Southcoastffc]

When will people (pundits, commentators, players, fans) understand that it doesn't matter if the carded player "got the ball"?  It was, in the judgment of the ref, a reckless tackle. That's all that counts.

[rebel]

The Brentford bench were all clapping before they saw the red card, then they all saw red, there's a song in there as they play in red.

[Sting of the North]

When will people (pundits, commentators, players, fans) understand that it doesn't matter if the carded player "got the ball"?  It was, in the judgment of the ref, a reckless tackle. That's all that counts.

This, although catching the ball is most likely deemed as a mitigating factor by many, including referees. Should not be overturned if the red was shown because of a subjectively deemed reckless tackle, only if the red was shown for something that objectively actually didn't take place (as can be the case when for example simulation is involved). Straight red is always 3 games is it?

[Southcoastffc]

When will people (pundits, commentators, players, fans) understand that it doesn't matter if the carded player "got the ball"?  It was, in the judgment of the ref, a reckless tackle. That's all that counts.

This, although catching the ball is most likely deemed as a mitigating factor by many, including referees. Should not be overturned if the red was shown because of a subjectively deemed reckless tackle, only if the red was shown for something that objectively actually didn't take place (as can be the case when for example simulation is involved). Straight red is always 3 games is it?

"Law 12

SERIOUS FOUL PLAY

A tackle or challenge that endangers the safety of an opponent or uses excessive force or brutality must be sanctioned as serious foul play.

Any player who lunges at an opponent in challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs, with excessive force or endangers the safety of an opponent is guilty of serious foul play."


Re suspensions, no,  Red Card for. e.g., handball denying goal scoring opportunity - 1 game;  offensive language - 2 games;  serious foul play - 3 games.    (Variations can occur for repeat offences of course)

[Moltobueno]

I think it's 50-50 and up to the referee. Surely worth a yellow and can't complain if a referee decided for a sending off.
Brentford constant whining/complaining (Norgaards booking for example) with the referee throughout the game didn't make their lives easier aswell.

Disagree with fulhamben - his foot was pretty much 90 degrees and he didn't even try to put toes in front - straight studs ahead:


And if it's "impossible to tackle without studs showing" - then he shouldn't tackle when seeing he can't control it. Or if you are having a go, then you must be aware of the consequences (which is a red card in this case).

Brentfords managers face after that tackle pretty much showed how nasty it was at the current moment.

[General]

I think it's 50-50 and up to the referee. Surely worth a yellow and can't complain if a referee decided for a sending off.
Brentford constant whining/complaining (Norgaards booking for example) with the referee throughout the game didn't make their lives easier aswell.

Disagree with fulhamben - his foot was pretty much 90 degrees and he didn't even try to put toes in front - straight studs ahead:


And if it's "impossible to tackle without studs showing" - then he shouldn't tackle when seeing he can't control it. Or if you are having a go, then you must be aware of the consequences (which is a red card in this case).

Brentfords managers face after that tackle pretty much showed how nasty it was at the current moment.

I've seen the image used by brentford fans a lot, but it misses the entire context of the tackle... he went flying in and definitely wasn't under any control due to the sheer speed. He went in for the tackle well before he got the ball and it may have been for the fact the swansea player slowed down that he didn't actually get the swansea player in the leg.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2xrJnycteU  - Tackle can be seen between 48 secs and 55. It's also interesting, watching back, that there was another quite overeager tackle in the build up to Henry's attempted tackle, which was from behind/the side of Ayew. Could count for something. The speed at which the tackle happened in real time makes it understandable why the Ref sent him off.

[rebel]

That was potentially a leg breaker all day long. These guys are 'supreme athletes', so can dodge bullets most of the time, but get caught and it could finish a players career.

At one time it was acceptable and expected by both sides, these are very different times.

[General]

It also doesn't look like Rico Henry even gets the ball with the swansea player getting it first before trying to get it past him. Based on the law that someone's copied in above, I'd be suprised to see if it is overturned. Brentford don't seem to have a huge depth in defence. Only Julian Jeanvier has over 20 appearances this season. The remaining three have 17 appearances between them all season.

[Andy S]

In answer to the original question. No it should stand as it was a dangerous tackle where players could have bee seriously hurt

[rebel]

It also doesn't look like Rico Henry even gets the ball with the swansea player getting it first before trying to get it past him. Based on the law that someone's copied in above, I'd be suprised to see if it is overturned. Brentford don't seem to have a huge depth in defence. Only Julian Jeanvier has over 20 appearances this season. The remaining three have 17 appearances between them all season.

Have you got the minutes played?

[_Putney_]

How anyone can say that is a red card is beyond me.

Video from that angle: https://imgur.com/De6OGCH

[General]

How anyone can say that is a red card is beyond me.

Watch the clip. It's not about finding the least offensive stills you can and using them as an arguement. It's the whole thing.

[General]

It also doesn't look like Rico Henry even gets the ball with the swansea player getting it first before trying to get it past him. Based on the law that someone's copied in above, I'd be suprised to see if it is overturned. Brentford don't seem to have a huge depth in defence. Only Julian Jeanvier has over 20 appearances this season. The remaining three have 17 appearances between them all season.

Have you got the minutes played?

https://www.whoscored.com/Teams/189/Show/England-Brentford

The defence is

Dominic Thompson  6 mins played apparently
Ethan Pinnock             3129
Pontus Jansson            3122
Henrik Dalsgaard         3869
Rico Henry                 4105
Julian Jeanvier        2211
Luka Racic                  238
Mads Roerslev Rasmussen    515

[rebel]

Henry's first reaction is to look at the Ref, that really says it all.

[_Putney_]

How anyone can say that is a red card is beyond me.

Watch the clip. It's not about finding the least offensive stills you can and using them as an arguement. It's the whole thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2xrJnycteU

Watch the clip. Watch the replay. Play it at a slow speed if you need to.  It's the whole thing buddy boy.