NFR: Crypto Currencies

[Woolly Mammoth]

I have withdrawn my initial investment a couple of weeks ago, but have kept the profit that accrued in there and it has been more or less rising ever since.
But I check it every day as I am aware of the dangers of fluctuation and free fall.

[General]

Also, the thing that may be useful to understand is that not only are these currencies going to continuously go up in value and as they get more mainstream through payments systems legitimising them, institutional investors buying into them and financial products being offered off them, they're also creating through blockchain a whole new economy in terms of mechanisms to trade via and secure value of Intellectual property.

Something associated with cryptocurrency which people don't understand for an example is that of smart contracts and non-fungible tokens.

Blockchain technology simply allows direct use of smart contracts and it's security features to allow ownership of products and direct payments to the beneficial owners or creators of original music or art for instance.

Christie's art house has recently traded some art on NFT'S and concluded the sale fully through crypto.

Honestly, whilst I appreciate this is something people fear and push back against it simply will be a big part of the future. We're still relatively early days in it though and it will still continue to go up and down. I do expect it to stabilise at some stage in my lifetime though.

Examples of potential growth.

ADA (Also known as cardano) is expected to go up from its current price of just over $1usd.. to up to 35$. Long term.

BtC conservatively is expected to go upto conservatively at this point 100-150,000$..

You have to do your own research..  the bitcoin standard is a good book to start with, watch things from Charles hoskinson (a seeming very level headed individual who also created two of the biggest cryptocurrencies), etc etc etc.

[General]

I have withdrawn my initial investment a couple of weeks ago, but have kept the profit that accrued in there and it has been more or less rising ever since.
But I check it every day as I am aware of the dangers of fluctuation and free fall.

The reality is that currently there are going to be fluctuations until it reaches a wider mass adoption but gains can be made (and lost).

Recently it went down 20-30% but has stabilised since and many have started growing again..

The next halving of bitcoin won't be for a couple of years i believe. There are some who believe there'll be a bear market before the years out so its definitely something to keep and eye out on. But thats just sensible when watching investments.

Glad you've benefitted from it Woolley.

[Plodder]

I posed this question a few pages ago. What happens once all 21 million Bitcoins have been mined?  How do economies grow if based purely on cryptocurrencies of which there is a finite stock?  Furthermore, because some people have lost and will lose their private keys to their Bitcoin wallets or have died without leaving their private key instructions to anybody, the actual amount of available bitcoin in circulation becomes even smaller.

I genuinely fear for a world in which cryptocurrencies replace fiat as the major currency behind economies.  I think it would badly damage the lives of billions. It would take an essay or even a book to set out all the reasons, but I'll summarise just two, as mentioned by Tim Harford, a respected economist, statistician and thinker:  (1) Your bank can send a replacement internet banking login if you forget yours or lose it. Lose the passcode to your Bitcoin wallet, and you can kiss all your money goodbye (2) Banks and other intermediaries who hold/control fiat currencies can also resolve disputes. How best to do that with blockchain "smart contracts" is most kindly described as an evolving conversation.

[General]

I posed this question a few pages ago. What happens once all 21 million Bitcoins have been mined?  How do economies grow if based purely on cryptocurrencies of which there is a finite stock?  Furthermore, because some people have lost and will lose their private keys to their Bitcoin wallets or have died without leaving their private key instructions to anybody, the actual amount of available bitcoin in circulation becomes even smaller.

I genuinely fear for a world in which cryptocurrencies replace fiat as the major currency behind economies.  I think it would badly damage the lives of billions. It would take an essay or even a book to set out all the reasons, but I'll summarise just two, as mentioned by Tim Harford, a respected economist, statistician and thinker:  (1) Your bank can send a replacement internet banking login if you forget yours or lose it. Lose the passcode to your Bitcoin wallet, and you can kiss all your money goodbye (2) Banks and other intermediaries who hold/control fiat currencies can also resolve disputes. How best to do that with blockchain "smart contracts" is most kindly described as an evolving conversation.

Both valid points and in truth not fully addressed across the bitcoin spectrum. I imagine that's something regulation may try and deal with.

Counterarguments have been put forward.. firstly.. in the amount of security you have and levels of it you control. A unique password (ok nothing special), followed by two stage security checks (include a phone number), thirdly a 12 unique word code you have to know and write in a specific order. On top of that some exchanges also now ask for ID, which some are worried about giving to exchanges but others aren't. This does give some guarantees although not perfect. The other reality, although in an extreme case, is that people argue that with those levels of personalised security on a decentralised platform you are less likely to have your assets for instance frozen- admittedly there's a need for your assets to be frozen in the first instance which many would query, but I think someone in Germany got arrested recently and simply didn't give up his security passwords and therefore maintained access and control of the wealth he did have.

It's less about the freezing of assets but more around the illusion that you can't lose your assets in a bank or through legitimate means (ie being hacked, the bank losing it by overstretching or going bust (lehmann brothers, barings etc)..


I think the idea behind bitcoins all being in circulation is that the price goes up and stabilises and becomes the hedge in the same way gold is. I am speculating on that point though.

[Logicalman]

No but I can strongly recommend on BBC SOUNDS the "Missing Crypto Queen " Which examines how Dr Ruja Ignatova persuaded millions to join her financial revolution. Then she disappeared.
It is brilliant

I do not normally believe anything the bbc produces, but yes this Bulgarian woman scammed the world with One Coin which was suppose to rival Bitcoin. However, she disappeared must be about 3 years ago now and is still currently on the run. I believe the FBI found her guilty in her absence.

I thought her brother got nicked for being involved in that as well.
Personally I think she's brown bread as she was just the front for the scam.

If you into this, listen to the Lazarus Heist (BBC Podcast), 2 seasons of it, and pretty explosive with all the crap that DRK group has become involved in, from a 1 Billion dollar heist, through the wanna-cry virus, and so much more. Wouldn't suprise me if the Lazarus group were involved in the One Coin scam as well, to a degree.

[blingo]

I'm still involved but everything I now own, including my bitcoins and ethereum are all running on free money, so im quite happy to wait for the next bull run.

Never invest money in crypto or stocks that you cant afford to lose, and remember that two in the bush are better than one in the hand.

[Logicalman]

You can either invest and enjoy the ride or stay out and be cynical..
At the end f the day i.e today, the £1 anyone invested in Bitcoin a three years ago is worth an awful lot more today.

Cynical has nothing to do with not investing. Investing in Crypto has not - yet - reached an acceptable or appropriate standard imo, then again, I don't bet either.

My investments are safe enough, as much as most I feel, and simply because I do not wish to invest in bitcoin does not make me stand out from the bigger crowd of non-investors as you might claim. To me, it's just a matter of personal trust and insurance against loss, and given the more recent failures of both Crypto and regular banks, at least the latter have somewhat of a backed-up assurance which the former does not appear interested in generally providing.

[H4usuallysitting]

I wouldn't even know where to start with crypto....best left alone for me

[Woolly Mammoth]

I withdrew my initial investment some time ago, but have kept the profit that accrued in there.
I do check it every day as I am aware of the dangers of fluctuation and free fall.

[Gloucester White]

I trade futures and there's a futures contract for Bitcoin and a few others. The chart of Bitcoin over the last couple of years roughly follows that of the American stock indices, if that continues then IMO there is a big risk of prices falling heavily, starting next month; so don't invest more than you can afford to lose.

American banks are continuing to go bust as their loans on commercial property go belly up and that will be the catalyst for a credit crunch and financial meltdown.

[blingo]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

[Woolly Mammoth]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

I have never been comfortable with gambling ever since i put a hundred quid on a horse called Dobbin and the wind blew it off.

[Gloucester White]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

Sound advice. Not sure about 500% in 10 years! But cryptos could benefit from a 'flight to safety' as other assets plunge. Usually the US dollar is the safe home, but that looks a bit sick medium/long term.

[Plodder]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

500% over the next ten years for bitcoin and ethereum?  What is the evidence or reasoning?  Extravagant claims like this (usually made by investors with a vested interest), attract people who then fail to read your final sentence or don't understand its importance, lured instead by the "get rich quick" headline.

[Gloucester White]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

500% over the next ten years for bitcoin and ethereum?  What is the evidence or reasoning?  Extravagant claims like this (usually made by investors with a vested interest), attract people who then fail to read your final sentence or don't understand its importance, lured instead by the "get rich quick" headline.

I personally don't believe 500% for a minute, but I can't agree that the way Blingo has explained the risks would entice anyone to invest just on that 'forecast'. There is no 'get rich quick headline'.

[Plodder]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

500% over the next ten years for bitcoin and ethereum?  What is the evidence or reasoning?  Extravagant claims like this (usually made by investors with a vested interest), attract people who then fail to read your final sentence or don't understand its importance, lured instead by the "get rich quick" headline.

I personally don't believe 500% for a minute, but I can't agree that the way Blingo has explained the risks would entice anyone to invest just on that 'forecast'. There is no 'get rich quick headline'.

The attraction of 500% over ten years is very much a "get rich quick" headline.  When we had this discussion in 2021, Blingo said that Bitcoin (at about £40K then) would reach 100,000 sterling and Ethereum (at about £3K) would reach £10,000. Compare with what actually happened. If a professional financial adviser tantalised potential investors with this kind of return, it would be malpractice.

[Gloucester White]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

500% over the next ten years for bitcoin and ethereum?  What is the evidence or reasoning?  Extravagant claims like this (usually made by investors with a vested interest), attract people who then fail to read your final sentence or don't understand its importance, lured instead by the "get rich quick" headline.

I personally don't believe 500% for a minute, but I can't agree that the way Blingo has explained the risks would entice anyone to invest just on that 'forecast'. There is no 'get rich quick headline'.

The attraction of 500% over ten years is very much a "get rich quick" headline.  When we had this discussion in 2021, Blingo said that Bitcoin (at about £40K then) would reach 100,000 sterling and Ethereum (at about £3K) would reach £10,000. Compare with what actually happened. If a professional financial adviser tantalised potential investors with this kind of return, it would be malpractice.

I can't be bothered to go through the whole of this thread and count the number of times Blingo advises to thoroughly research and understand the product before investing, but that number will be high. To think that someone would ignore that and invest money just on the basis of one forecast (which to you counts as a headline) is just plain silly IMO.

Advisors are always talking rubbish. the financial 'expert' in the Telegraph announced a new bull market in the NASDAQ last August. Nonsense, and a few days later in the comments I suggested that the top of the bounce was in that day and the down trend would resume; I was right. It's behind a paywall, but if anyone subscribes to the DT I'll let you have a link to the article and my comments. There are no 'experts' in the financial world, but there are experienced traders.

[blingo]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

Sound advice. Not sure about 500% in 10 years! But cryptos could benefit from a 'flight to safety' as other assets plunge. Usually the US dollar is the safe home, but that looks a bit sick medium/long term.

Do you not think that bitcoin will hit 150k over the next ten years? You're putting all the likely factors forward in your statement above

[blingo]

If you are going to buy crypto, first do your homework and secondly don't trade, look at it long term and it will pay off, certainly with both bitcoin and ethereum. 500% over the next ten years is far from unrealistic. However always do your own research and never invest in anything you don't feel comfortable with.

Sound advice. Not sure about 500% in 10 years! But cryptos could benefit from a 'flight to safety' as other assets plunge. Usually the US dollar is the safe home, but that looks a bit sick medium/long term.

Do you not think that bitcoin will hit 150k over the next ten years? You're putting all the likely factors forward in your statement above

Look at bitcoin like digital gold and eth like digital oil. Both have massive potential upside, and with proper regulation, even more so as institutional money arrives