Stuart Gray

[Steven Ageroad]

I'm glad he's back, anything to help our defence out but my question is, if he is good at his job surely he would have been working at another club and would not have been so readily available.

[HV71]

I'm glad he's back, anything to help our defence out but my question is, if he is good at his job surely he would have been working at another club and would not have been so readily available.

I understand your point but it can often be something of a 'closed shop' as managers often take their entourage of coaches with them.

[MJG]

I know in your mind what you want to be true is...

You would do well not to be so patronising and dismissive (including to toshes mate above) .

All I am doing is treating the narrative pushed by the club with caution where they've on obvious motive to lie or mislead, which is the same approach I take to anyone in any walk of life.

You on the other hand may be a very shrewd person generally but when it comes to the club you will swallow what they tell you. I've no doubt if they told you to transfer some money to an account in Nigeria to claim your winnings in the state lottery you'd do it.

Perhaps if/when they give you the ultimate mugging in a couple of weeks by announcing that the riverside development isn't going ahead, you'll reconsider that approach.

With the stand its reporting from meetings etc, I've said elsewhere that it's down to one person who could switch it off. If they do it more fool them as we need to build the stand. It won't only be who is mugged off its everyone of us with the promise it will get built along with lots of staff working on it.

As for the other stuff. You have your views and I have mine. Anything I know is from a number of different places and only when I have heard something twice from different places then I take it.

All sides can use lies and misleading statements. Every manager/player/coach/owner/DOF or whoever in life have their ways of getting their own pov and message across. It's up to the individual to make their mind up on believing any one explanation or not believing any of them at all.
I'm not going to go down the route of the personal comments your making but only to say that's what I would expect from you anyway when questioned and not agreeing with someone.

[toshes mate]

Couple of different places, meetings and people. Your reply and someone else yesterday goes back to a post I made last week.
Everything Slav touched was gold and everything else was crap or others you don't like make the decision.
I liked Slav, wanted him to stay, stuck with wanting him to stay on the two other occasions people wanted out. But he wasn't perfect and this I felt at the time was an error on his part.

For sure nobody is perfect and humans are so flawed it is wonder we ever survived this long as a species.  My regard about hearsay is what I responded to you recently on another thread which is if you were not present at the actual event then whatever you are told is hearsay, an anecdotal account.  Anecdotes are not evidence.  Think about the last controversial football incident you witnessed alongside thousands of others and there will be several conflicting witness statements if you bothered to research for them.  The person who sacked Gray was the person who didn't extend his contract and I do not believe SJ was ever in charge of contracts.  Was SJ asked about Gray's contract and, if so, how was the question framed? = e.g. you can have either (a) or (b) but you cannot have both, perhaps.  You are on dangerous ground stating 'facts' without chapter and verse.

Are you going to ask everyone on here to produce an affidavit on here when they give an answer to a question posed? maybe the FOF terms of use should be changed?
As I say below "there is no right or wrong answer, only the answer you want it to be."

You claim to be 'ITK', MJG, I have never done so, because I do not consider the need to be 'ITK' to be part of these debates.  In fact I doubt there is anyone on this forum who is really 'ITK'.  You rub shoulders with people who have agendas which are nothing to do with having a good team playing on the pitch.  That is the nature of football.  There may be 'people' you know who are closer to other 'people' who may claim to be 'ITK' but that is inconsequential in the greater scheme of things.  I will once again mention all the explanations of the AK incidents and how he was supposed to have fought Mitro (regurgitated again in the press today), supposed to have fought Parker, and so on, and yet it is plain to see nobody on here actually witnessed anything and simply relayed gossip.  They can have their fun if they feel it makes them more important but I expect better than that of myself.

Continue writing your anecdotes on anecdotes by all means but don't think I won't be picking you up on it whenever I feel the need.  I chew things over and sometimes swallow them but when I taste something rather unpleasant I will spit it out. 

[toshes mate]

You would do well not to be so patronising and dismissive (including to toshes mate above) .

Perhaps, MJG, caught on the defensive is being coached by a friend of a friend of an Italian who once claimed to be an expert in defensive techniques .....

[filham]

God to hear that Gray is back, we need him to spend the next 48 hours working on Rico, we really need to improve his performance with crosses.

[snarks]

Can we not turn this in to having a go at someone else over a difference of opinion. MJG needs no cheerleaders but he is clearly passionate and involved with Fulham, Statto and Toshes mate share the same passions with different views but I never understand the confrontation over who's views are more accurate/correct.

Anyway, I'm just glad SG is back, Parker can learn from him.

[Skatzoffc]

God to hear that Gray is back, we need him to spend the next 48 hours working on Rico, we really need to improve his performance with crosses.

Let's not start blaming the keeper now pls?

We've been after, and failed to get, a CDM for 4 seasons running now.
That is why we're crap in defence.

Not because of the keeper.

[Sting of the North]

God to hear that Gray is back, we need him to spend the next 48 hours working on Rico, we really need to improve his performance with crosses.

Let's not start blaming the keeper now pls?

We've been after, and failed to get, a CDM for 4 seasons running now.
That is why we're crap in defence.

Not because of the keeper.

I would think the keeper should be judged on his own performances within a reasonable context. Just because you we allegedly have a crap defence because of a lack of a CDM (I assume you mean that the 3 we played with last game is not good enough) doesn't mean that the keeper cannot be criticized for below par contributions. I agree though if your point is that the keeper is not the only (and quite likely in my opinion far from the biggest) problem.

I also thought that people in general were quite happy with KMac's contributions as a CDM in the past seasons, and can't recall this being a thing before this season really.

[Beamer]

Why still no confirmation on the website or am I just losing my mind.

[HV71]

Can we not turn this in to having a go at someone else over a difference of opinion. MJG needs no cheerleaders but he is clearly passionate and involved with Fulham, Statto and Toshes mate share the same passions with different views but I never understand the confrontation over who's views are more accurate/correct.

Anyway, I'm just glad SG is back, Parker can learn from him.

Good post - I'm glad he is back . I also respect and enjoy the views of all the posters you mention - it just gets a tad turgid when they start arguing whose conked is the biggest

[HV71]

Should be conker

[Bracken White]

Absolutely crazy not to renew his contract last summer - had got the defence functioning.
A wise head to help Scott Parker too, very good news!

[Chesh]

Is Gray being back just a so far unconfirmed rumour started as a lie by Sky Sports News, or does anyone have a more concrete indication that this is the case?

[Steven Ageroad]

Good luck to him. Bearing in mind the quality of the players in our defence, it will be like trying to "turn a sow's ear into a silk purse".

[MJG]

Is Gray being back just a so far unconfirmed rumour started as a lie by Sky Sports News, or does anyone have a more concrete indication that this is the case?

confirmed at press conference, unfortunately I don't have it written down anywhere or on film but I could produce a tweet from one of local press guys but I might get accused of photoshopping it so won't.

Edit.. club tweeted his return with photos 15 minutes ago.

[Chesh]

Is Gray being back just a so far unconfirmed rumour started as a lie by Sky Sports News, or does anyone have a more concrete indication that this is the case?

confirmed at press conference, unfortunately I don't have it written down anywhere or on film but I could produce a tweet from one of local press guys but I might get accused of photoshopping it so won't.

Edit.. club tweeted his return with photos 15 minutes ago.

Yes, just seen, thanks - I was beginning to wonder lol!

[Statto]

Is Gray being back just a so far unconfirmed rumour started as a lie by Sky Sports News, or does anyone have a more concrete indication that this is the case?

confirmed at press conference, unfortunately I don't have it written down anywhere or on film but I could produce a tweet from one of local press guys but I might get accused of photoshopping it so won't.

Edit.. club tweeted his return with photos 15 minutes ago.

Lolz how you insult two posters with comments like 'you will believe what you want to believe' , then when it gets dished back you turn into a total princess and say you won't engage in personal insults, then before the day is out go back to sarcastic comments and digs

I prefer the more direct approach tbh, eg, 'you are a tw@t'

[Twig]

As much as many of us respected SJ, I think we have to accept that he had his weak spots.  Mike has presented an extract from the minutes of a Trust meeting and tbh I can't really think why AM would lie to the trust on who decided not to renew SG's contract.  If it was SJ then fine let's move on, at least Stuart is back now.

[MJG]

Is Gray being back just a so far unconfirmed rumour started as a lie by Sky Sports News, or does anyone have a more concrete indication that this is the case?

confirmed at press conference, unfortunately I don't have it written down anywhere or on film but I could produce a tweet from one of local press guys but I might get accused of photoshopping it so won't.

Edit.. club tweeted his return with photos 15 minutes ago.

Lolz how you insult two posters with comments like 'you will believe what you want to believe' , then when it gets dished back you turn into a total princess and say you won't engage in personal insults, then before the day is out go back to sarcastic comments and digs

I prefer the more direct approach tbh, eg, 'you are a tw@t'

You're just confirming what I said about you below with that response.
If you get upset by a bit of sarcasm god forbid how you would react if someone actually called you a twit.