News we all expected but a mate of mine has a dad in clearing out houses for people about to leave and he's doing Bryan's house at the moment says he's off in jan
Good luck to him. Erevdise, Serie A, and maybe even Bundesliga will do him good.
Can I buy his hair dryer?
Werder Bremen...
This worries me for two reasons:
1. How come the only club that seems to be interested in him is one with no money?
2. With his house now cleared, will Bryan have to spend Christmas in a tent in Bishop's Park?
If Ruiz does leave it will leave a hole. David and Woodrow could easily slot in that role, but one has a bad attitude, and the other has falling out of favour. Hyndman I guess could be interesting, as he is one of the best passers at our club, and would add a bit of creative edge, but maybe not his preferred position.
I expect him to leave, and do wonder why he continues to play, unless Kit has a replacement lined up
wonder what we get for him.
one point to make - he looked crestfallen when subbed against watford, as if he really cared.
Can't say in surprised or even too bothered about this. As long as others are brought in, he's done quite well since he came back and has helped to turn us around but he isn't the saviour some would like to think he is.
It depends how much we get for him, if it's 2 mill or less I'd say just keep him and lose him for nothing but any more than that and we should take the money. Football's a business after all.
I think Kit was wrong to take him off the other night instead of fofana, lately ruiz' work rate has improved and I don't think Fofana contributed anything that ruiz wouldn't have. We missed his creativity and link from defence to attack.
Having said that after weighing up the pros and cons I think we should take monty pythons advice and "welease bwyan"
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 07, 2014, 08:54:40 AM
It depends how much we get for him, if it's 2 mill or less I'd say just keep him and lose him for nothing but any more than that and we should take the money. Football's a business after all.
I think Kit was wrong to take him off the other night instead of fofana, lately ruiz' work rate has improved and I don't think Fofana contributed anything that ruiz wouldn't have. We missed his creativity and link from defence to attack.
+1
Ruiz has been a decent buy, he has always given his best and on occasion he has been a class above. The loyalty he has demonstrated by dropping down a division and playing in a situation where many other players would of thrown their toys out and forced a move has earn him a great deal of my respect. I will be sad to see him go and I wish him all the best.
Quote from: Chutney on December 07, 2014, 09:44:30 AM
Ruiz has been a decent buy, he has always given his best and on occasion he has been a class above. The loyalty he has demonstrated by dropping down a division and playing in a situation where many other players would of thrown their toys out and forced a move has earn him a great deal of my respect. I will be sad to see him go and I wish him all the best.
It was a good post until you said ruiz has shown loyalty. Ruiz isn't here because he wants to help Fulham back up, more like no one was willing to pay the right price for him and he was stuck here.
And I don't remember him showing much loyalty last year when all he cared about was the world cup. Ditching us for psv to be guaranteed first team football rather than help us avoid relegation doesn't warrant a loyalty sticker in my eyes.
I can't deny he has been trying but if the right club wants him in January, he won't hesitate or think twice about where Fulham are. Award him for his efforts lately but please not his loyalty
He's been loyal in that he has played when asked, in whatever position he's been asked for whichever manager has been in charge. I'm not saying he cares about fulham because he probably doesn't, i'm just saying well done to him for getting on with it and honouring his contract instead of refusing to play and throwing a tantrum like so many others would of done.
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 07, 2014, 09:57:33 AM
Quote from: Chutney on December 07, 2014, 09:44:30 AM
Ruiz has been a decent buy, he has always given his best and on occasion he has been a class above. The loyalty he has demonstrated by dropping down a division and playing in a situation where many other players would of thrown their toys out and forced a move has earn him a great deal of my respect. I will be sad to see him go and I wish him all the best.
It was a good post until you said ruiz has shown loyalty. Ruiz isn't here because he wants to help Fulham back up, more like no one was willing to pay the right price for him and he was stuck here.
And I don't remember him showing much loyalty last year when all he cared about was the world cup. Ditching us for psv to be guaranteed first team football rather than help us avoid relegation doesn't warrant a loyalty sticker in my eyes.
I can't deny he has been trying but if the right club wants him in January, he won't hesitate or think twice about where Fulham are. Award him for his efforts lately but please not his loyalty
wasnt that the same situation for hugo though? didnt we sign smith on dead line day because we thought hugo was off, but his suitors dropped out. didnt bobby z only stay with us because hull wouldnt pay him what he wanted too?
I'd be interested to see Ross McCormack drop into the '#10' role, behind the front two and then put Matt Smith up top. His flick ons for Hugo running behind would be fun to watch
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 10:39:09 AM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 07, 2014, 09:57:33 AM
Quote from: Chutney on December 07, 2014, 09:44:30 AM
Ruiz has been a decent buy, he has always given his best and on occasion he has been a class above. The loyalty he has demonstrated by dropping down a division and playing in a situation where many other players would of thrown their toys out and forced a move has earn him a great deal of my respect. I will be sad to see him go and I wish him all the best.
It was a good post until you said ruiz has shown loyalty. Ruiz isn't here because he wants to help Fulham back up, more like no one was willing to pay the right price for him and he was stuck here.
And I don't remember him showing much loyalty last year when all he cared about was the world cup. Ditching us for psv to be guaranteed first team football rather than help us avoid relegation doesn't warrant a loyalty sticker in my eyes.
I can't deny he has been trying but if the right club wants him in January, he won't hesitate or think twice about where Fulham are. Award him for his efforts lately but please not his loyalty
wasnt that the same situation for hugo though? didnt we sign smith on dead line day because we thought hugo was off, but his suitors dropped out. didnt bobby z only stay with us because hull wouldnt pay him what he wanted too?
Yes but Hugo has openly admitted he wants to stay now and was only ever leaving because he didn't think he would play much here. Ruiz wants to leave because he's convinced he's above us and this level which I suppose he is but funny other clubs haven't seen it that way with a year to go on his contract.
Hugo also didn't leave in January and ditch us regardless of never playing. He ended up being important to us in the end. I like ruiz but I think it's laughable to call him loyal just because he's still here. There's a lot more to it than that
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 07, 2014, 11:29:09 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 10:39:09 AM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 07, 2014, 09:57:33 AM
Quote from: Chutney on December 07, 2014, 09:44:30 AM
Ruiz has been a decent buy, he has always given his best and on occasion he has been a class above. The loyalty he has demonstrated by dropping down a division and playing in a situation where many other players would of thrown their toys out and forced a move has earn him a great deal of my respect. I will be sad to see him go and I wish him all the best.
It was a good post until you said ruiz has shown loyalty. Ruiz isn't here because he wants to help Fulham back up, more like no one was willing to pay the right price for him and he was stuck here.
And I don't remember him showing much loyalty last year when all he cared about was the world cup. Ditching us for psv to be guaranteed first team football rather than help us avoid relegation doesn't warrant a loyalty sticker in my eyes.
I can't deny he has been trying but if the right club wants him in January, he won't hesitate or think twice about where Fulham are. Award him for his efforts lately but please not his loyalty
wasnt that the same situation for hugo though? didnt we sign smith on dead line day because we thought hugo was off, but his suitors dropped out. didnt bobby z only stay with us because hull wouldnt pay him what he wanted too?
Yes but Hugo has openly admitted he wants to stay now and was only ever leaving because he didn't think he would play much here. Ruiz wants to leave because he's convinced he's above us and this level which I suppose he is but funny other clubs haven't seen it that way with a year to go on his contract.
Hugo also didn't leave in January and ditch us regardless of never playing. He ended up being important to us in the end. I like ruiz but I think it's laughable to call him loyal just because he's still here. There's a lot more to it than that
you have far more faith in players than i do. i believe that if somone had of wanted him, hugo would have gone in the summer. and i believe if somone better wants him in jan then he will be off then too. its funny how players like saha steed and dempsey are deemed as greats, yet threw there toys out of the pram to get moves, and yet ruiz has stayed and just got on with it in a lower league, and he has no loyalty. hell even the great murphy walked out on us because he couldnt get what he wanted, and some still scream for him to be given a coaching role
We still need to match the Football League's Financial Fair Play, and receiving £2m to further improve, as well as getting his wages away from the football club is worth it. Let him go, it's been a sad 30 months with him, never eclipsing his talent in Holland, bar the odd moment.
Quote from: FPT on December 07, 2014, 12:27:05 PM
We still need to match the Football League's Financial Fair Play, and receiving £2m to further improve, as well as getting his wages away from the football club is worth it. Let him go, it's been a sad 30 months with him, never eclipsing his talent in Holland, bar the odd moment.
don't talk sense about FFP most people think Khan just has to write a cheque out for £40m and all will be sorted, expect he can't do that.
Quote from: jimmyc19 on December 07, 2014, 12:03:18 AM
News we all expected but a mate of mine has a dad in clearing out houses for people about to leave and he's doing Bryan's house at the moment says he's off in jan
Ruiz lives in an apartment according to a source close to the club and his paper bill is paid till after January, more pure tosh
Quote from: jimmyc19 on December 07, 2014, 12:03:18 AM
News we all expected but a mate of mine has a dad in clearing out houses for people about to leave and he's doing Bryan's house at the moment says he's off in jan
i feel sorry for bryan having to live in an empty house until january
what dose your mates dad do with all the stuff?
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 11:36:27 AM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 07, 2014, 11:29:09 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 10:39:09 AM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 07, 2014, 09:57:33 AM
Quote from: Chutney on December 07, 2014, 09:44:30 AM
Ruiz has been a decent buy, he has always given his best and on occasion he has been a class above. The loyalty he has demonstrated by dropping down a division and playing in a situation where many other players would of thrown their toys out and forced a move has earn him a great deal of my respect. I will be sad to see him go and I wish him all the best.
It was a good post until you said ruiz has shown loyalty. Ruiz isn't here because he wants to help Fulham back up, more like no one was willing to pay the right price for him and he was stuck here.
And I don't remember him showing much loyalty last year when all he cared about was the world cup. Ditching us for psv to be guaranteed first team football rather than help us avoid relegation doesn't warrant a loyalty sticker in my eyes.
I can't deny he has been trying but if the right club wants him in January, he won't hesitate or think twice about where Fulham are. Award him for his efforts lately but please not his loyalty
wasnt that the same situation for hugo though? didnt we sign smith on dead line day because we thought hugo was off, but his suitors dropped out. didnt bobby z only stay with us because hull wouldnt pay him what he wanted too?
Yes but Hugo has openly admitted he wants to stay now and was only ever leaving because he didn't think he would play much here. Ruiz wants to leave because he's convinced he's above us and this level which I suppose he is but funny other clubs haven't seen it that way with a year to go on his contract.
Hugo also didn't leave in January and ditch us regardless of never playing. He ended up being important to us in the end. I like ruiz but I think it's laughable to call him loyal just because he's still here. There's a lot more to it than that
you have far more faith in players than i do. i believe that if somone had of wanted him, hugo would have gone in the summer. and i believe if somone better wants him in jan then he will be off then too. its funny how players like saha steed and dempsey are deemed as greats, yet threw there toys out of the pram to get moves, and yet ruiz has stayed and just got on with it in a lower league, and he has no loyalty. hell even the great murphy walked out on us because he couldnt get what he wanted, and some still scream for him to be given a coaching role
They achieved a lot more at Fulham to warrant the title of great. But they are great because of how good they were and not their loyalty. Ruiz has done neither so there's a big difference.
I don't remember anyone saying Steed, what a loyal player? More like Steed was a talented player who did well at Fulham.
Ruiz may still be here and fair play to him for not kicking up a fuss but does that make him loyal? He will jump at the chance to leave and is here against his will.
Maybe praise ruiz for his attitude and professionalism, but loyalty is definitely the wrong word especially after taking the easy option in January to avoid a relegation battle
I don't buy the Ruiz is loyal line for staying. He would have been off of anyone had coughed up enough to take him, and no one did. And I don't want to hear the deal ran out of time, lots of other deals got done.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on December 07, 2014, 02:01:24 PM
Not bothered whether he stays or not, I don't think we will miss him at all.
Again we agree sir. I'm not fussed either way, the system might actually change if ruiz goes. I don't think it's a big issue either way. It's more important we keep players like LVC now
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on December 07, 2014, 02:01:24 PM
Not bothered whether he stays or not, I don't think we will miss him at all.
we wouldnt miss any of our squad if they left
Quote from: Ged on December 07, 2014, 01:26:08 PM
Quote from: jimmyc19 on December 07, 2014, 12:03:18 AM
News we all expected but a mate of mine has a dad in clearing out houses for people about to leave and he's doing Bryan's house at the moment says he's off in jan
i feel sorry for bryan having to live in an empty house until january
what dose your mates dad do with all the stuff?
holding it until he moves apparantly
Quote from: Deanothefulhamfan on December 07, 2014, 07:32:42 AM
If Ruiz does leave it will leave a hole. David and Woodrow could easily slot in that role, but one has a bad attitude, and the other has falling out of favour. Hyndman I guess could be interesting, as he is one of the best passers at our club, and would add a bit of creative edge, but maybe not his preferred position.
I expect him to leave, and do wonder why he continues to play, unless Kit has a replacement lined up
I agree Hyndmann is a like for like replacement. This is his favoured position and has handled the physical side better, even as an 18 year old.I wold like to see Woodrow given more playing time as I believe we play better with him holding up the ball and bringing wider players into the game
Quote from: MasterHaynes on December 07, 2014, 04:43:13 PM
Quote from: Deanothefulhamfan on December 07, 2014, 07:32:42 AM
If Ruiz does leave it will leave a hole. David and Woodrow could easily slot in that role, but one has a bad attitude, and the other has falling out of favour. Hyndman I guess could be interesting, as he is one of the best passers at our club, and would add a bit of creative edge, but maybe not his preferred position.
I expect him to leave, and do wonder why he continues to play, unless Kit has a replacement lined up
I agree Hyndmann is a like for like replacement. This is his favoured position and has handled the physical side better, even as an 18 year old.I wold like to see Woodrow given more playing time as I believe we play better with him holding up the ball and bringing wider players into the game
really? id push lvc up there before i would hyndman. cant remember him ever taking players on or having a shot
Quote from: epsomraver on December 07, 2014, 12:59:16 PM
Quote from: jimmyc19 on December 07, 2014, 12:03:18 AM
News we all expected but a mate of mine has a dad in clearing out houses for people about to leave and he's doing Bryan's house at the moment says he's off in jan
Ruiz lives in an apartment according to a source close to the club and his paper bill is paid till after January, more pure tosh
Your right ER he does live in an apartment.
I know this for sure because my Uncles Sister in laws great aunts cousin on her Godparents
side have a son who delivers Domino Pizzas.
Brian ordered double anchovies on his Sat night, but when it was delivered
he refused to open the door, and was heard to be sobbing inside,"How dare that
Kit Symons substitute a superstar like me.
The Pizza was left on the doormat...... :005:
Agree with Reith L, would also like to see Ross Mc in the no 10 role. You would get at least the same amount of invention coupled with one hell of a lot more effort.
One area you would miss Ruiz, would be his height, particulrly defending set plays.
As a team, excluding Burn we struggle for height.
Your right it does, but if that heart beat is go long at every chance then players like LVC will not develop
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 02:24:26 PM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on December 07, 2014, 02:01:24 PM
Not bothered whether he stays or not, I don't think we will miss him at all.
we wouldnt miss any of our squad if they left
Yet another well reasoned thought out reply fp.gif
Should Bryan Ruiz leave the Cottage in January, how does everyone think it might work if Ross drops back into the Number 10 role just behind the strikers, leaving Hugo and Woodrow to form a partnership up front. I'm sure McCormack has the skill and the nous for the role and could still be expected to chime in with a fair quota of goals from that position. What do others think of the idea?
WM i agree we seem to have good ball players however we are not utilising them fully, when we have played well it has come because we have controlled the ball. Hugo (and I am not a fan) is certainly not a target man, he would want the ball in front to react too and finish.
LVC and SP look really good when we work the ball, not to use that hinders our performances for me, the long ball, or direct pass is a great option to have as a back up but for a team like us I do not thin it works as a plan A. people will say we have won games with it, but if we look at those games they were games where we actually got the ball down and played, not hoofing it forwad.
Just listening to a discussion on Talksport, initiated by Colin Murray about whether fans today go to games more to judge than to cheer the team on.
I think that's a valid point. As an older fan I see a lot of difference in younger fans - analaysing every aspect of each player's performance, and harshly judging the team if it comes up short in a game...
rather than someone like me, who thinks it's my team, and i'll get behind the players, even though I'm aware they have faults, and may not be the greatest players.
For me, if a player seems weak in some way, I'll probably get behind him more, as long as he seems to be playing his best.
Not saying my view is right, maybe i'm too soft and old fashioned - but just remarking on what seems a big change in fans' attitudes.
Ray, I am 44 and I will take Hugo as an example, I am not a fan, far from it in fact, but when he has that shirt on I will support him 100% for the entire time he is on the pitch. With Ruiz I am a fan but he frustrates me a lot as he has not produced what I know he can, but again he gets 100% backing from me when he is on that pitch for us.
I wonder if prescribing roles too tightly takes away fluidity from the play, and holding various diamond formations etc. takes focus away from watching the ball and the opponents?
Quote from: epsomraver on December 08, 2014, 09:14:38 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 02:24:26 PM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on December 07, 2014, 02:01:24 PM
Not bothered whether he stays or not, I don't think we will miss him at all.
we wouldnt miss any of our squad if they left
Yet another well reasoned thought out reply fp.gif
so who pray tell is irreplaceable in our squad then? this isnt like the good old days, when you lost a saha and a dembele and you knew we would never get that quality back again easily. other than maybe lvc, and maybe hugo, who would we struggle to replace?
Why do players need to be loyal? Why does that even matter? They're paid to do a job, I don't blame players for leaving if they feel the club isn't going in the right direction for them. Players like Ruiz shouldn't be playing in the championship. if the argument that players should want to play for the club and that means loyalty points, then get rid of the current squad. Losing 5.0 in a gutless performance doesn't show me any passion for the shirt.
I assume that all players will play at the highest, best paid, level they can manage.
Ruiz will leave if he gets an attractive offer and we almost certainly need to get him off our pay roll.
Now look, Ruiz is reportedly on a high salary and at he best has had a mediocre season so far in the championship so who on earth is going to pay us a fee and match his wages. I would think he will be with us until the end of the season and he will then spend a lot of time looking for a club that will be prepared to take him on a free transfer.
Quote from: jimmyc19 on December 07, 2014, 12:03:18 AM
News we all expected but a mate of mine has a dad in clearing out houses for people about to leave and he's doing Bryan's house at the moment says he's off in jan
Maybe he is moving to be closer to the ground? :dft011:
Maybe the relegation pay cut was such that he's had to sell all his furniture.
Ruiz is a quality player, but Symons is definitely accommodating him at the moment. We are playing very narrow, and its not helping the defence at all. One he has gone, I hope we start employing a 4-4-2 formation, with hopefully a recalled Kaca on one wing, and maybe Williams on the other. It means that the full backs won't have to bomb forward, and we hopefully ship less goals.
Quote from: Riether Lightning 63 on December 07, 2014, 11:22:59 AM
I'd be interested to see Ross McCormack drop into the '#10' role, behind the front two and then put Matt Smith up top. His flick ons for Hugo running behind would be fun to watch
Matt Smith is awful.
Ruiz has never come out and said he wants to leave.Also he has been loyal to the club no matter what and he was hurt being withdrawn on fri v watford,I BELIEVE he cares a lot and I felt when he went off we lost any chance of scoring and played into watfords hands,I'm lining myself up to be shot at,but THIS is my opinion.
Quote from: hovewhite on December 08, 2014, 02:38:00 PM
Ruiz has never come out and said he wants to leave.Also he has been loyal to the club no matter what and he was hurt being withdrawn on fri v watford,I BELIEVE he cares a lot and I felt when he went off we lost any chance of scoring and played into watfords hands,I'm lining myself up to be shot at,but THIS is my opinion.
I agree it was wrong to take him off and it killed off any chance of staying in the game. I also agree he showed great professionalism when he was taken off, he never moans but and it's a big but I'm a bit confused how ruiz has been loyal?
He's our longest serving player but that doesn't take much considering the recent clear out. He isn't here because he believes it's right to stay with Fulham, he's here because no one rescued him in time.
I'm convinced your all using the wrong word. Just because he doesn't have a tantrum about leaving it doesn't make him loyal, just professional and respectful. There's a difference
Dannyboi,I understand your opinion,and respect it.Its just mine is different to yours that doesn't mae me right or wrong and vica versa ,I just BELIEVE he's wants fulham to get back to the PL.I'm probably wrong but I like him as an effective player and contributes a lot in my opinion.
I think he's one of the best ball players I've ever seen in a Fulham shirt (since the mid 70s) and will be sorry to see him go.
Plus... I'll have no-one to shout 'Pura Vida' at.
Quote from: hovewhite on December 08, 2014, 03:09:19 PM
Dannyboi,I understand your opinion,and respect it.Its just mine is different to yours that doesn't mae me right or wrong and vica versa ,I just BELIEVE he's wants fulham to get back to the PL.I'm probably wrong but I like him as an effective player and contributes a lot in my opinion.
Considering I agreed with half of your post I think the capital letters were a bit unnecessary. I assumed you believed he was loyal because that's exactly what you said the first time.
I just think differently that's all. I wonder how many capitals you would use if someone really disagreed with you? Some aren't so pleasant
I like ruiz by the way and if you reread what I put in the first place I wasn't hating on him at all. It's just common knowledge he doesn't really want to be here and if he genuinely cared about wanting Fulham in the premier league, why did he run to Holland in January instead of helping us to stay there in the first place? Ruiz also admitted moments before signing for us that he didn't really want to come to fulham because he was holding out for someone better.
I still respect your opinion but there's just a couple of facts to back up my opinion. I don't just disagree for the fun of it
Quote from: Mince n Tatties on December 07, 2014, 06:34:54 AM
Werder Bremen...
One of the Sunday papers reports that Werder will offer £3.5 million for Ruiz in January but we want nearer £5 million.
The report also mentions that he is on £45,000 a week which maybe a stumbling block to a move
if ruiz goes we will have 11 players on the pitch at last
ross, IMO should be pushed further forward to link more closely with the center forward. At the moment ross has to be far too deep just to make up for Ruiz's ineffectvity. the extra player will now contribute just behind them in a way that it isn't currently happening.
I agree with the last post. If we can get someone with the ability to hold the ball and then bring the two front men into play regularly, it will not only create more goal scoring opportunities but should also eradicate the current "hoof it" from the back mentality and play more to our best player's strengths i.e. Scott can just intercept/win the ball then pass it short, Hugo will have some balls on the floor to run on to, Ross won't have to play around the halfway line and down the wings in an effort to generate some action for us. Can't wait!
Why does it matter if Ruiz is loyal again?
I don't think we'll stick to the diamond once Kit has the opportunity to build his own team. I think we'll progress into a 442 and the exit of Bryan Ruiz would only aid that. We're only playing a diamond because it suits our squad most, he's making the most with what he's got.
Quote from: fulhamben on December 08, 2014, 11:34:56 AM
Quote from: epsomraver on December 08, 2014, 09:14:38 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 02:24:26 PM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on December 07, 2014, 02:01:24 PM
Not bothered whether he stays or not, I don't think we will miss him at all.
we wouldnt miss any of our squad if they left
Yet another well reasoned thought out reply fp.gif
so who pray tell is irreplaceable in our squad then? this isnt like the good old days, when you lost a saha and a dembele and you knew we would never get that quality back again easily. other than maybe lvc, and maybe hugo, who would we struggle to replace?
Well Mc Cormack for one, George Williams for another, Pat Roberts for three, need I go on?
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 08, 2014, 04:10:12 PM
Quote from: hovewhite on December 08, 2014, 03:09:19 PM
Dannyboi,I understand your opinion,and respect it.Its just mine is different to yours that doesn't mae me right or wrong and vica versa ,I just BELIEVE he's wants fulham to get back to the PL.I'm probably wrong but I like him as an effective player and contributes a lot in my opinion.
Considering I agreed with half of your post I think the capital letters were a bit unnecessary. I assumed you believed he was loyal because that's exactly what you said the first time.
I just think differently that's all. I wonder how many capitals you would use if someone really disagreed with you? Some aren't so pleasant
I like ruiz by the way and if you reread what I put in the first place I wasn't hating on him at all. It's just common knowledge he doesn't really want to be here and if he genuinely cared about wanting Fulham in the premier league, why did he run to Holland in January instead of helping us to stay there in the first place? Ruiz also admitted moments before signing for us that he didn't really want to come to fulham because he was holding out for someone better.
I still respect your opinion but there's just a couple of facts to back up my opinion. I don't just disagree for the fun of it
Why is it common knowledge he wants to leave? his agent says so? wonder why he would do that? not anything to do with a big fat commission? Hugo wanted to go at the end of last season, nobody wanted him so he has stayed , nobody seems to doubt his sincerity now?
At the risk of you lot taking the mickey, I have met Ruiz a few times and he is a bloody nice, unassuming bloke - just saying - look no further than Surbiton for his abode !!
Quote from: FFC1987 on December 08, 2014, 04:53:19 PM
Why does it matter if Ruiz is loyal again?
I don't remember saying it mattered if he was loyal, I just think it degrades the meaning of the word to suggest that ruiz has been loyal to fulham.
I suppose in modern football just over 3 years deserves a medal but let's be fair we would've been lucky to get anywhere near what we paid for him at any stage over his time here. Other clubs refused to pay it and let's be honest, he has never come close to warranting his price tag or deadline day excitement.
Only now is he really in a position to leave and just like Hugo his deal fell through and no one else wanted him. He didn't choose to stay.
This year is the only one where he can genuinely say "I'm better than this" and surprise surprise he's linked with moves away. He's a very nice guy, I met him outside motspur and he got out of his car to take his picture with my daughter, I totally respect him as a person and he has behaved in a very good way unlike others in the past.
But that does not make him loyal, it makes him a good professional. I'm not bothered that he's not loyal, the debate started because someone said he is.
Pre season I was in Jenbac Austria to watch the match against Risapore. At half time together with my son and grandson we went to the rear of the stand where those players not playing were practicing on the neighbouring pitch. Ruiz was sitting on his own at the side of the pitch looking rather forlorn as if no one was allowed to be with him. He looked completely ostracized by Magath and I was completely surprised he stayed at the club. His inclusion into the team by Kit has been vindicated by the results to date. There have been exceptions such as last Friday. I first thought then that Kit had made the right decision to sub Ruiz after the sending off, but in hindsight think he should have taken off Fofana. Ruiz in my opinion needs to find another club as he is not a Championship type player and we need players who will fight hard to retain their place in the team.
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 08, 2014, 06:37:16 PM
Quote from: FFC1987 on December 08, 2014, 04:53:19 PM
Why does it matter if Ruiz is loyal again?
I don't remember saying it mattered if he was loyal, I just think it degrades the meaning of the word to suggest that ruiz has been loyal to fulham.
I suppose in modern football just over 3 years deserves a medal but let's be fair we would've been lucky to get anywhere near what we paid for him at any stage over his time here. Other clubs refused to pay it and let's be honest, he has never come close to warranting his price tag or deadline day excitement.
Only now is he really in a position to leave and just like Hugo his deal fell through and no one else wanted him. He didn't choose to stay.
This year is the only one where he can genuinely say "I'm better than this" and surprise surprise he's linked with moves away. He's a very nice guy, I met him outside motspur and he got out of his car to take his picture with my daughter, I totally respect him as a person and he has behaved in a very good way unlike others in the past.
But that does not make him loyal, it makes him a good professional. I'm not bothered that he's not loyal, the debate started because someone said he is.
The post wasn't directed at only you, a quick read just made me wonder why people think he needs to be loyal. The word loyal kept coming up, he acts professionally, he's been good to the fans and probably feels the championship isn't for him so I couldn't blame him for wanting out. I don't think ill ever understand the need for loyalty in football when its designed to be a mercenaries game.
Quote from: FFC1987 on December 09, 2014, 09:31:48 AM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 08, 2014, 06:37:16 PM
Quote from: FFC1987 on December 08, 2014, 04:53:19 PM
Why does it matter if Ruiz is loyal again?
I don't remember saying it mattered if he was loyal, I just think it degrades the meaning of the word to suggest that ruiz has been loyal to fulham.
I suppose in modern football just over 3 years deserves a medal but let's be fair we would've been lucky to get anywhere near what we paid for him at any stage over his time here. Other clubs refused to pay it and let's be honest, he has never come close to warranting his price tag or deadline day excitement.
Only now is he really in a position to leave and just like Hugo his deal fell through and no one else wanted him. He didn't choose to stay.
This year is the only one where he can genuinely say "I'm better than this" and surprise surprise he's linked with moves away. He's a very nice guy, I met him outside motspur and he got out of his car to take his picture with my daughter, I totally respect him as a person and he has behaved in a very good way unlike others in the past.
But that does not make him loyal, it makes him a good professional. I'm not bothered that he's not loyal, the debate started because someone said he is.
The post wasn't directed at only you, a quick read just made me wonder why people think he needs to be loyal. The word loyal kept coming up, he acts professionally, he's been good to the fans and probably feels the championship isn't for him so I couldn't blame him for wanting out. I don't think ill ever understand the need for loyalty in football when its designed to be a mercenaries game.
And id agree with you, loyalty and football don't go together any more and we tended to do ok without it in the 16 years al fayed was here.
The word loyal only kept coming up because someone claimed ruiz deserved a move because of his loyalty to fulham which I found very odd. He has been very kind and respectful in his time here and dare I say it even a team player even if he's a tad lazy.
But calling him loyal after 3 years and very little return is very generous and a little insulting to the likes of Simon Morgan who was Mr loyal. I won't play the Cohen or Haynes card because that was before my time but loyalty is certainly the wrong word to call ruiz in my opinion.
I don't think it's a big deal whether he stays or goes anyway, if he stays great because on his day he is a good player but if he goes hopefully the system will change to give the side more width and balance.
It's a win win as far as I'm concerned because the club won't get much money for him anyway, so it's a matter of what's best for the club and id say it's 50/50
Quote from: epsomraver on December 08, 2014, 05:54:29 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 08, 2014, 11:34:56 AM
Quote from: epsomraver on December 08, 2014, 09:14:38 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 02:24:26 PM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on December 07, 2014, 02:01:24 PM
Not bothered whether he stays or not, I don't think we will miss him at all.
we wouldnt miss any of our squad if they left
Yet another well reasoned thought out reply fp.gif
so who pray tell is irreplaceable in our squad then? this isnt like the good old days, when you lost a saha and a dembele and you knew we would never get that quality back again easily. other than maybe lvc, and maybe hugo, who would we struggle to replace?
Well Mc Cormack for one, George Williams for another, Pat Roberts for three, need I go on?
roberts never plays so lee cook could replace him, and ross isnt that special. few assists yes, but a poor goal return, and cant take a set piece to save his life. and george was replaced with some untried city kid against watford.
didnt ross score a screaming free kick early in the season, sure it was him, also are pens counted as set pieces?
& assists is pretty decent though, all in all thats 11 goals he has contributed too (not including goals from free kicks he won), how many goals have we score din total and what % contribution does that 11 make (am sure someone has that stat)?
Quote from: westcliff white on December 09, 2014, 11:42:42 AM
didnt ross score a screaming free kick early in the season, sure it was him, also are pens counted as set pieces?
& assists is pretty decent though, all in all thats 11 goals he has contributed too (not including goals from free kicks he won), how many goals have we score din total and what % contribution does that 11 make (am sure someone has that stat)?
1 in about 20 does not make you a specialist free kick taker. yes he has scored pens but any striker should. look at watford game, not one corner or free kick found a white shirt. and for paritys sake i wouldnt let ruiz take one either. i would get lvc to take them as ive seen him score a few
If ruiz does go then we need to bring in another quality midfielder as replacement plus a defensive athletic ,strong cm (which we have been lacking all season )
i wasnt saying he was a specialist was just asking if he did. blimey people are touchy on this board these days, used to be a nice friendly place to banter.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on December 09, 2014, 01:14:37 PM
I assume that the one thing in common we all have is that we support Fulham through thick and thin, note thick than thin sometimes. I think you will all agree to support Fulham as we do, the one thing you need is a sense of humour at all times, otherwise we would probably lose the will to live, if we happen to one day get to Wembley again, and say some unlikely player maybe say Matt Smith or even Brian Ruiz if they are still around, scored a dramatic winner in the last minute to send us all into raptures, and we could all die happy people, we would be all jumping and down shaking each other's hands if we happen to be sitting in the same spot, not knowing who each other was, even having a drink together in celebration cause Italy never happen again. But the point I am making is that people get angry with each other on this board, and I am not blaming anyone in particular over the most trivial differences of opinion, just because someone does not like another persons view. Well please remember that one day we all may be at Wembley and that divine moment may come with an unlikely hero, and the sun will be shinning and we will all be chums in our black and white for a while or maybe for ever, depending on how many beers we sink down our necks at the time. So we all sometimes think we are right all the time. But others can come up with a better idea. Brian Clough once said, " I have only been wrong once, and that is when I thought I was wrong but I wasn't, I was right all the time ", he had a sense of humour.
So cheer up and spare a thought for that day at Wembley, it just may come along sooner than we think, and there is nothing wrong in having a dream. That's what keeps us all going through the thick and the thin. We are all Fulham supporters and there ain't that many of us, so let's stick together whether we agree or not.
this makes me angry
Fulhamben - I think 1/20 does make you pretty good at freekicks going by all stats, they aren't really quite as useful as you'd think...
http://www.optasportspro.com/about/optapro-blog/posts/2013/augmenting-free-kick-data-for-more-meaningful-results.aspx (http://www.optasportspro.com/about/optapro-blog/posts/2013/augmenting-free-kick-data-for-more-meaningful-results.aspx)
Quote from: fiveclack on December 09, 2014, 01:39:48 PM
Fulhamben - I think 1/20 does make you pretty good at freekicks going by all stats, they aren't really quite as useful as you'd think...
http://www.optasportspro.com/about/optapro-blog/posts/2013/augmenting-free-kick-data-for-more-meaningful-results.aspx (http://www.optasportspro.com/about/optapro-blog/posts/2013/augmenting-free-kick-data-for-more-meaningful-results.aspx)
i cant believe somone has worked that, out only had quick glance, but wasnt 5% the average, ie the not very good ones. ross either hits the wall or finds row z. our best corner was the one ross actually decided to stand in the box for, which is something he should do more of. i could understand him taking them if they were any good. time and time again him and ruiz hit the first man, its time to change it as a couple have resulted in the oppo breaking quick and scoring
Quote from: epsomraver on December 07, 2014, 12:59:16 PM
Quote from: jimmyc19 on December 07, 2014, 12:03:18 AM
News we all expected but a mate of mine has a dad in clearing out houses for people about to leave and he's doing Bryan's house at the moment says he's off in jan
Ruiz lives in an apartment according to a source close to the club and his paper bill is paid till after January, more pure tosh
I think he might live around Surbiton way somewhere. He walked past me as I was having a smoke outside The Victoria pub on Victoria Road. Taller than I expected, with lovely hair.
Quote from: RaySmith on December 08, 2014, 10:49:42 AM
Just listening to a discussion on Talksport, initiated by Colin Murray about whether fans today go to games more to judge than to cheer the team on.
I think that's a valid point. As an older fan I see a lot of difference in younger fans - analaysing every aspect of each player's performance, and harshly judging the team if it comes up short in a game...
rather than someone like me, who thinks it's my team, and i'll get behind the players, even though I'm aware they have faults, and may not be the greatest players.
For me, if a player seems weak in some way, I'll probably get behind him more, as long as he seems to be playing his best.
Not saying my view is right, maybe i'm too soft and old fashioned - but just remarking on what seems a big change in fans' attitudes.
I'm with you, Ray.
I could not care if he stays or goes
I think that he is a very talented footballer but is not suited to playing in England
MY big worry is how much we can get for him probably nothing like the money we paid for him
and considering he was supposed to have been this great player at the world cup there are not that many clubs knocking at the door with check book in hand
I think a lot of clubs saw him previous to the world cup then saw him out there but decided to wait and see how he performed when back at Fulham knowing if he failed to impress they could reduce the price and that is why he probably did not go in the summer
Quote from: fulhamben on December 07, 2014, 05:07:32 PM
Quote from: MasterHaynes on December 07, 2014, 04:43:13 PM
Quote from: Deanothefulhamfan on December 07, 2014, 07:32:42 AM
If Ruiz does leave it will leave a hole. David and Woodrow could easily slot in that role, but one has a bad attitude, and the other has falling out of favour. Hyndman I guess could be interesting, as he is one of the best passers at our club, and would add a bit of creative edge, but maybe not his preferred position.
I expect him to leave, and do wonder why he continues to play, unless Kit has a replacement lined up
I agree Hyndmann is a like for like replacement. This is his favoured position and has handled the physical side better, even as an 18 year old.I wold like to see Woodrow given more playing time as I believe we play better with him holding up the ball and bringing wider players into the game
really? id push lvc up there before i would hyndman. cant remember him ever taking players on or having a shot
Agree. Hyndman links play from defence to attack or other areas of the midfield. Never a replacement for Ruiz.
Ruiz is the most talented player on the team. There, I said it (again). Just for balance, because all you Ruiz haters tend to have a monopoly on comments re: Ruiz. But I'm not going to get into a stupid protracted back and forth about it. He's likely leaving when his time is up, so what does it really matter?
I hope he goes the first day of the transfer period. Yes, he's helping us and yes, he's the most talented player we have, but what is that when measured against guessing who the next Fulham Pariah will be. Fulham supporters and 13-year-old girls seemingly MUST identify somebody to hate and then scream that hate incessantly.
Quote from: HatterDon on December 09, 2014, 10:59:46 PM
I hope he goes the first day of the transfer period. Yes, he's helping us and yes, he's the most talented player we have, but what is that when measured against guessing who the next Fulham Pariah will be. Fulham supporters and 13-year-old girls seemingly MUST identify somebody to hate and then scream that hate incessantly.
Ruiz has got a vast array of talents, but we are definitely trying to accommodate him. The narrow formation is just to build the team around. I hope, when he leaves, we move back to the more traditional wing play.
Quote from: Forever Fulham on December 09, 2014, 09:35:11 PM
Ruiz is the most talented player on the team. There, I said it (again). Just for balance, because all you Ruiz haters tend to have a monopoly on comments re: Ruiz. But I'm not going to get into a stupid protracted back and forth about it. He's likely leaving when his time is up, so what does it really matter?
If Talent is being slow of mind and body, weak in the tackle and a bottler, you are right !
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 10, 2014, 09:16:59 AM
Quote from: Forever Fulham on December 09, 2014, 09:35:11 PM
Ruiz is the most talented player on the team. There, I said it (again). Just for balance, because all you Ruiz haters tend to have a monopoly on comments re: Ruiz. But I'm not going to get into a stupid protracted back and forth about it. He's likely leaving when his time is up, so what does it really matter?
If Talent is being slow of mind and body, weak in the tackle and a bottler, you are right !
Another factless and uniformed statement, try watching the game!
Quote from: epsomraver on December 10, 2014, 10:26:09 AM
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 10, 2014, 09:16:59 AM
Quote from: Forever Fulham on December 09, 2014, 09:35:11 PM
Ruiz is the most talented player on the team. There, I said it (again). Just for balance, because all you Ruiz haters tend to have a monopoly on comments re: Ruiz. But I'm not going to get into a stupid protracted back and forth about it. He's likely leaving when his time is up, so what does it really matter?
If Talent is being slow of mind and body, weak in the tackle and a bottler, you are right !
Another factless and uniformed statement, try watching the game!
+1 epsomraver. If you have watched FFC recently, you'd know he's been winning more headers, making more tackles, and he has a very good footballing mind. I'll give you one point, he is slow.
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 10, 2014, 10:40:41 AM
Quote from: epsomraver on December 10, 2014, 10:26:09 AM
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 10, 2014, 09:16:59 AM
Quote from: Forever Fulham on December 09, 2014, 09:35:11 PM
Ruiz is the most talented player on the team. There, I said it (again). Just for balance, because all you Ruiz haters tend to have a monopoly on comments re: Ruiz. But I'm not going to get into a stupid protracted back and forth about it. He's likely leaving when his time is up, so what does it really matter?
If Talent is being slow of mind and body, weak in the tackle and a bottler, you are right !
Another factless and uniformed statement, try watching the game!
+1 epsomraver. If you have watched FFC recently, you'd know he's been winning more headers, making more tackles, and he has a very good footballing mind. I'll give you one point, he is slow.
you say that and to a point he gives that impression but the theory is for him to hold the ball and then draw players on to him thus hopefully freeing up other Fulham players to pass to, there are so many who take their seats and as soon as he touches the ball start moaning about him, mind you that applies to a lot of other players too, but Ruiz is the favourite for the moaners followed by Parker.
Quote from: epsomraver on December 10, 2014, 10:45:51 AM
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 10, 2014, 10:40:41 AM
Quote from: epsomraver on December 10, 2014, 10:26:09 AM
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 10, 2014, 09:16:59 AM
Quote from: Forever Fulham on December 09, 2014, 09:35:11 PM
Ruiz is the most talented player on the team. There, I said it (again). Just for balance, because all you Ruiz haters tend to have a monopoly on comments re: Ruiz. But I'm not going to get into a stupid protracted back and forth about it. He's likely leaving when his time is up, so what does it really matter?
If Talent is being slow of mind and body, weak in the tackle and a bottler, you are right !
Another factless and uniformed statement, try watching the game!
+1 epsomraver. If you have watched FFC recently, you'd know he's been winning more headers, making more tackles, and he has a very good footballing mind. I'll give you one point, he is slow.
you say that and to a point he gives that impression but the theory is for him to hold the ball and then draw players on to him thus hopefully freeing up other Fulham players to pass to, there are so many who take their seats and as soon as he touches the ball start moaning about him, mind you that applies to a lot of other players too, but Ruiz is the favourite for the moaners followed by Parker.
I don't understand how people can slate Parker?! He is playing in a new position for him, on his own at defensive mid, and with that defence behind him. Parker is one of the key players in the team.
Quote from: HatterDon on December 09, 2014, 10:59:46 PM
I hope he goes the first day of the transfer period. Yes, he's helping us and yes, he's the most talented player we have, but what is that when measured against guessing who the next Fulham Pariah will be. Fulham supporters and 13-year-old girls seemingly MUST identify somebody to hate and then scream that hate incessantly.
Our most talented is Ross. Naive and probably one of a few who think this, but McC is the boss
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 07, 2014, 09:57:33 AM
Quote from: Chutney on December 07, 2014, 09:44:30 AM
Ruiz has been a decent buy, he has always given his best and on occasion he has been a class above. The loyalty he has demonstrated by dropping down a division and playing in a situation where many other players would of thrown their toys out and forced a move has earn him a great deal of my respect. I will be sad to see him go and I wish him all the best.
It was a good post until you said ruiz has shown loyalty. Ruiz isn't here because he wants to help Fulham back up, more like no one was willing to pay the right price for him and he was stuck here.
And I don't remember him showing much loyalty last year when all he cared about was the world cup. Ditching us for psv to be guaranteed first team football rather than help us avoid relegation doesn't warrant a loyalty sticker in my eyes.
I can't deny he has been trying but if the right club wants him in January, he won't hesitate or think twice about where Fulham are. Award him for his efforts lately but please not his loyalty
He's been an expensive disaster for his entire spell here. End of.
I haven't been more excited about a player leaving since Senderos.
i dont mind if he leaves, we could fill that role easily. We'd obviously buy a replacement but we dont have to. Ross behind Hugo and another striker would be great. Or we could play roberts there, or eisfeld if he's good enough, and not to forget chris david.
Quote from: epsomraver on December 10, 2014, 10:45:51 AM
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 10, 2014, 10:40:41 AM
Quote from: epsomraver on December 10, 2014, 10:26:09 AM
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 10, 2014, 09:16:59 AM
Quote from: Forever Fulham on December 09, 2014, 09:35:11 PM
Ruiz is the most talented player on the team. There, I said it (again). Just for balance, because all you Ruiz haters tend to have a monopoly on comments re: Ruiz. But I'm not going to get into a stupid protracted back and forth about it. He's likely leaving when his time is up, so what does it really matter?
If Talent is being slow of mind and body, weak in the tackle and a bottler, you are right !
Another factless and uniformed statement, try watching the game!
+1 epsomraver. If you have watched FFC recently, you'd know he's been winning more headers, making more tackles, and he has a very good footballing mind. I'll give you one point, he is slow.
you say that and to a point he gives that impression but the theory is for him to hold the ball and then draw players on to him thus hopefully freeing up other Fulham players to pass to, there are so many who take their seats and as soon as he touches the ball start moaning about him, mind you that applies to a lot of other players too, but Ruiz is the favourite for the moaners followed by Parker.
Quote from: epsomraver on December 10, 2014, 10:26:09 AM
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 10, 2014, 09:16:59 AM
Quote from: Forever Fulham on December 09, 2014, 09:35:11 PM
Ruiz is the most talented player on the team. There, I said it (again). Just for balance, because all you Ruiz haters tend to have a monopoly on comments re: Ruiz. But I'm not going to get into a stupid protracted back and forth about it. He's likely leaving when his time is up, so what does it really matter?
If Talent is being slow of mind and body, weak in the tackle and a bottler, you are right !
Another factless and uniformed statement, try watching the game!
Factless ?? OK Ruiz is a poor tackler - fact. Ruiz is slow - fact. Ruiz has lovely hair - fact, when he first came to Fulham, I was excited by his potential as he was clearly very effective at Twente, he had a stinker during his debut (Blackburn I think) and was subbed at halftime. During the rest of the season he scored 2 great goals, both chips over the keeper, but was generally inneffective and never lived up to his billing. The reason is simple, he has talent but needs to game played at a much slower rate. He was ok in the world cup because the temp was in the 80's and the game played much slower. He was good in Holland as the game is slower. These are all FACTS.. Now, I would agree he has been better in recent games, however he wants to leave Fulham (Fact) and will be gone on a free at the end of the season. He is playing in a lower league than last season and is still unable to shine. He is doing ok, nothing better. He earnes BIG BUCKS - fact. We can do a lot better for the money and with FFP we can't afford his wages for what he offers. I am very sad he has not lived up to my initial expectations. Ruiz has not been a disaster, but has massively dissapointed with the overall contribution he has made to FFC. He looks lovely, has wonderful hair and skin but to repeat is too slow, too weak and meak to be a real effective force in this league - ESP for what he cost and earns.
I watch the games very carefully, I have played football at a high level and think I know the game.
ruiz earns 30 k per week so large ocmpared to us but not compared to say rodders or possiblt McC.
he isn't rapid that's for sure, but his speed of mind is quick, he knows what he wants to do with the ball for sure, however he doesn't have the time, English football is quicker than most leagues. I am not knocking him at all have championed him, of late he has been good playing in a role that suits but we do seem to be shoe horning the formation around him, however having done that we should then play football and not be what is fast becoming a route one team. If you have a play of that type you have to give them a chance to show what they can do and currently the way we play may not be conducive to that.
I agree with most of the negative comments about Ruiz , and most of the positive ones too . He is an enigma, but so are most players who base their game on skill and touch .
One thing he is , is class and with him you have to look to what he gives the team or potentially gives the the team at any time .He is a luxury player , but does help us in our general play , gives confidence to younger players to emulate him and dare to hold on to the ball, in tight situations , resolving problems rather than just punting the ball forward , something I have NEVER seen ruiz do, in order to take the easy way out .
Most things we do go through him and Kit clearly sees him as a key player ,who gives us something different in a league full of players who bomb around , and in their own way are also very hit and miss.
One thing is definite , neither roberts , David nor eifeld are suitable replacements and the people who casually think it won't be a problem if we lose him ,need to think again. None of the mentioned players are at this moment any where near Ruiz .
I think we will keep him till the summer , and if we don't we are going to have to go back to the drawing board and change a lot more than one player in this squad , as well as our system ánd tactics .
I understand and share peoples frustration with ruiz but he is a very important player for us .
I haven't been involved in a good ruiz debate for a while and it may suprise you to know I do not think him the devil incarnate. However some of the fiction about him is amaziing. For a player of his reputed ability (the most talented player at the club i think I read somewhere above) I rarely notice him do anything devastatingly breathtaking. He did score two great chipped goals.... and one wonder strike last season off the bench. Other than those isolated events, in all this time i can't remeber him really being a major influence in the game.
In possesion he does not hold the ball rather than punt it, he holds the ball because he generally takes far too long in possesion and gets caught out as a result. I recall Ross playing a number of brilliant long passes to Hugo and ruiz in the penalty area, buit not ruiz to them. He is very poor at tackling but quite good at intercepting passes butr as he gets possesion he is so painfully slow in moving andf deciding what to do with the ball it usually counts for little.
Against watford his lack of effort and shirking of challenges and unwillingness to close down opponents was scandalous.
I have never accepted that he is that taleneted, he does have some ability but he generally keeps it to himself, we effectievly play with 10 men because of his inability to keep up with play.
And ask yourself, if he was really that good and after all everyone said about him and the purpoted brilliant world cup he had, why wasn't he snapped up in the close season? Magath didn't rate him so surely he would have been one of the first out of the door,
If he was really any good for our team we wouldn';t still be having this debate.
Ross is brilliant, he contributed from day one. Hugo has no first touch but his effort is exemplary and he is scoring, LVC is a star, Ruiz is lucky to have them around him.
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 01:11:15 PM
I haven't been involved in a good ruiz debate for a while and it may suprise you to know I do not think him the devil incarnate. However some of the fiction about him is amaziing. For a player of his reputed ability (the most talented player at the club i think I read somewhere above) I rarely notice him do anything devastatingly breathtaking. He did score two great chipped goals.... and one wonder strike last season off the bench. Other than those isolated events, in all this time i can't remeber him really being a major influence in the game.
In possesion he does not hold the ball rather than punt it, he holds the ball because he generally takes far too long in possesion and gets caught out as a result. I recall Ross playing a number of brilliant long passes to Hugo and ruiz in the penalty area, buit not ruiz to them. He is very poor at tackling but quite good at intercepting passes butr as he gets possesion he is so painfully slow in moving andf deciding what to do with the ball it usually counts for little.
Against watford his lack of effort and shirking of challenges and unwillingness to close down opponents was scandalous.
I have never accepted that he is that taleneted, he does have some ability but he generally keeps it to himself, we effectievly play with 10 men because of his inability to keep up with play.
And ask yourself, if he was really that good and after all everyone said about him and the purpoted brilliant world cup he had, why wasn't he snapped up in the close season? Magath didn't rate him so surely he would have been one of the first out of the door,
If he was really any good for our team we wouldn';t still be having this debate.
Ross is brilliant, he contributed from day one. Hugo has no first touch but his effort is exemplary and he is scoring, LVC is a star, Ruiz is lucky to have them around him.
100% agree with all of this post, written by someone who understands football.
To be fair he was taken off after 20 minutes against Watford.
Magath didn't rate him but he didn't rate Hugo either.
He has been a disappointment no question but he doesn't shirk, stays involved, keeps his position. The results since his return have been good. Not just down to him of course but he must be a contributing factor.
Ruiz is a different player in the championship to the premiership. Any comment on his performance in the Watford match this season is effectively null and void, he played for under 20 minutes, and the whole team were shocking.
He adds to the team and makes good passes and clears space for others. Fulham would be a worse team without him in the side, in fact they were, he didn't play in the first seven games which as everyone knows resulted in 1 point.
If he leaves, I'll be sad to see him go, to many people are quick to disparage all he does or adds to the team. I accept it's a personal opinion, but that's mine. <pokes out tongue>
the watford comment is harsh, he wen toff early due to the sending off and the rest of the team hardly covered themselves in glory that night
So, I've asked this before, but ... .
A couple of posts on this thread are about how much Ruiz makes and how much Hugo makes. It seems to me that there's some sort of regulation that keeps salaries OUT of the public domain, and that Fulham never discusses either transfer costs or salaries with the press. This being the case, how does ANYONE know for certain what Ruiz gets paid or other Fulham players?
the watford comment was absolutely valid, his lack of willingness to challenge for anything in that time was astounding and his lack of presence meant for the 20 minutes he was on we had a passenger. Kit had absolutely no heitation in replacing him...if he was that valuable he could hav etaken off somebody else.
Quote from: HatterDon on December 17, 2014, 02:39:12 PM
So, I've asked this before, but ... .
A couple of posts on this thread are about how much Ruiz makes and how much Hugo makes. It seems to me that there's some sort of regulation that keeps salaries OUT of the public domain, and that Fulham never discusses either transfer costs or salaries with the press. This being the case, how does ANYONE know for certain what Ruiz gets paid or other Fulham players?
We don't of course but Ruiz was sort after when we signed him and we got Hugo on a Bosman when he'd done pretty well at Hull.
They wouldn't have come to us unless we outbid other clubs that were interested.
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 02:44:50 PM
the watford comment was absolutely valid, his lack of willingness to challenge for anything in that time was astounding and his lack of presence meant for the 20 minutes he was on we had a passenger. Kit had absolutely no heitation in replacing him...if he was that valuable he could hav etaken off somebody else.
I think that's harsh. The performance up to that point was dreadful from all concerned.
I don't know Kit's thought process any more than anyone else but it had to be a quick decision taken unexpectedly.
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 02:44:50 PM
the watford comment was absolutely valid, his lack of willingness to challenge for anything in that time was astounding and his lack of presence meant for the 20 minutes he was on we had a passenger. Kit had absolutely no heitation in replacing him...if he was that valuable he could hav etaken off somebody else.
You see what you want to see, and indeed expect to see, but my opinion whilst it differs from yours is just that, an opinion.
Although I do think he was the logical one to take off against watford, it had little to do with his performance, the only player in that game that I wouldn't have taken off after 20 minutes was Betts. If Kit could have made 10 substitutions, he should have done it after 15 minutes of that game.
I seem to recall on here, people were rubbishing Kiraly, Fofana, Parker, Burns, Grimmer, Bod and Staff after the game, and as they all played badly it was fair comment. Mac and Hugo got away with it as they hardly touched the ball and LVC is everyones favourite at the moment (me included).
Quote from: snarks on December 17, 2014, 03:09:54 PM
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 02:44:50 PM
the watford comment was absolutely valid, his lack of willingness to challenge for anything in that time was astounding and his lack of presence meant for the 20 minutes he was on we had a passenger. Kit had absolutely no heitation in replacing him...if he was that valuable he could hav etaken off somebody else.
You see what you want to see, and indeed expect to see, but my opinion whilst it differs from yours is just that, an opinion.
Although I do think he was the logical one to take off against watford, it had little to do with his performance, the only player in that game that I wouldn't have taken off after 20 minutes was Betts. If Kit could have made 10 substitutions, he should have done it after 15 minutes of that game.
I seem to recall on here, people were rubbishing Kiraly, Fofana, Parker, Burns, Grimmer, Bod and Staff after the game, and as they all played badly it was fair comment. Mac and Hugo got away with it as they hardly touched the ball and LVC is everyones favourite at the moment (me included).
We can disagree I don't ever have an issue with that.
I actually don't see what i want to see, I know I have been vocal on this subject but because he is so underwhelming.
The whole team had a very poor night, personally i thought the center backs did OK but were left horribly exposed.
Where Ruiz was of particular note was that right in front of us he shirked three challenges, and took quite a lot of of abuse from people a bit behind me of a sort that i wouldn't have done. The rest tried very hard, but were awful on the day (it happens), I honestly did not feel his heart was in it at all.
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 17, 2014, 01:17:31 PM
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 01:11:15 PM
I haven't been involved in a good ruiz debate for a while and it may suprise you to know I do not think him the devil incarnate. However some of the fiction about him is amaziing. For a player of his reputed ability (the most talented player at the club i think I read somewhere above) I rarely notice him do anything devastatingly breathtaking. He did score two great chipped goals.... and one wonder strike last season off the bench. Other than those isolated events, in all this time i can't remeber him really being a major influence in the game.
In possesion he does not hold the ball rather than punt it, he holds the ball because he generally takes far too long in possesion and gets caught out as a result. I recall Ross playing a number of brilliant long passes to Hugo and ruiz in the penalty area, buit not ruiz to them. He is very poor at tackling but quite good at intercepting passes butr as he gets possesion he is so painfully slow in moving andf deciding what to do with the ball it usually counts for little.
Against watford his lack of effort and shirking of challenges and unwillingness to close down opponents was scandalous.
I have never accepted that he is that taleneted, he does have some ability but he generally keeps it to himself, we effectievly play with 10 men because of his inability to keep up with play.
And ask yourself, if he was really that good and after all everyone said about him and the purpoted brilliant world cup he had, why wasn't he snapped up in the close season? Magath didn't rate him so surely he would have been one of the first out of the door,
If he was really any good for our team we wouldn';t still be having this debate.
Ross is brilliant, he contributed from day one. Hugo has no first touch but his effort is exemplary and he is scoring, LVC is a star, Ruiz is lucky to have them around him.
100% agree with all of this post, written by someone who understands football.
Nose understands football 064.gif 064.gif 064.gif 064.gif
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Quote from: epsomraver on December 17, 2014, 03:31:49 PM
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 17, 2014, 01:17:31 PM
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 01:11:15 PM
I haven't been involved in a good ruiz debate for a while and it may suprise you to know I do not think him the devil incarnate. However some of the fiction about him is amaziing. For a player of his reputed ability (the most talented player at the club i think I read somewhere above) I rarely notice him do anything devastatingly breathtaking. He did score two great chipped goals.... and one wonder strike last season off the bench. Other than those isolated events, in all this time i can't remeber him really being a major influence in the game.
In possesion he does not hold the ball rather than punt it, he holds the ball because he generally takes far too long in possesion and gets caught out as a result. I recall Ross playing a number of brilliant long passes to Hugo and ruiz in the penalty area, buit not ruiz to them. He is very poor at tackling but quite good at intercepting passes butr as he gets possesion he is so painfully slow in moving andf deciding what to do with the ball it usually counts for little.
Against watford his lack of effort and shirking of challenges and unwillingness to close down opponents was scandalous.
I have never accepted that he is that taleneted, he does have some ability but he generally keeps it to himself, we effectievly play with 10 men because of his inability to keep up with play.
And ask yourself, if he was really that good and after all everyone said about him and the purpoted brilliant world cup he had, why wasn't he snapped up in the close season? Magath didn't rate him so surely he would have been one of the first out of the door,
If he was really any good for our team we wouldn';t still be having this debate.
Ross is brilliant, he contributed from day one. Hugo has no first touch but his effort is exemplary and he is scoring, LVC is a star, Ruiz is lucky to have them around him.
100% agree with all of this post, written by someone who understands football.
Nose understands football 064.gif 064.gif 064.gif 064.gif
Thank you..... I am assuming you are laughing with delight at my brilliance
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Seasons Greetings
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 03:15:32 PM
Quote from: snarks on December 17, 2014, 03:09:54 PM
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 02:44:50 PM
the watford comment was absolutely valid, his lack of willingness to challenge for anything in that time was astounding and his lack of presence meant for the 20 minutes he was on we had a passenger. Kit had absolutely no heitation in replacing him...if he was that valuable he could hav etaken off somebody else.
You see what you want to see, and indeed expect to see, but my opinion whilst it differs from yours is just that, an opinion.
Although I do think he was the logical one to take off against watford, it had little to do with his performance, the only player in that game that I wouldn't have taken off after 20 minutes was Betts. If Kit could have made 10 substitutions, he should have done it after 15 minutes of that game.
I seem to recall on here, people were rubbishing Kiraly, Fofana, Parker, Burns, Grimmer, Bod and Staff after the game, and as they all played badly it was fair comment. Mac and Hugo got away with it as they hardly touched the ball and LVC is everyones favourite at the moment (me included).
We can disagree I don't ever have an issue with that.
I actually don't see what i want to see, I know I have been vocal on this subject but because he is so underwhelming.
The whole team had a very poor night, personally i thought the center backs did OK but were left horribly exposed.
Where Ruiz was of particular note was that right in front of us he shirked three challenges, and took quite a lot of of abuse from people a bit behind me of a sort that i wouldn't have done. The rest tried very hard, but were awful on the day (it happens), I honestly did not feel his heart was in it at all.
As I say I didn't see that, I saw Burn get out manouvered by Deeney frequently, I saw Parker completely overrun and Fofana have a game where his first touch left him exposed.
Ruiz was just there, not good not worse than anyone else IMHO. If I were Kit, I would have still taken him off though. Overall, and this season only, I like what he brings to the team, even though he is the one player who also irritates me more when he gets it wrong, as he should do better.
Quote from: snarks on December 17, 2014, 04:18:59 PM
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 03:15:32 PM
Quote from: snarks on December 17, 2014, 03:09:54 PM
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 02:44:50 PM
the watford comment was absolutely valid, his lack of willingness to challenge for anything in that time was astounding and his lack of presence meant for the 20 minutes he was on we had a passenger. Kit had absolutely no heitation in replacing him...if he was that valuable he could hav etaken off somebody else.
You see what you want to see, and indeed expect to see, but my opinion whilst it differs from yours is just that, an opinion.
Although I do think he was the logical one to take off against watford, it had little to do with his performance, the only player in that game that I wouldn't have taken off after 20 minutes was Betts. If Kit could have made 10 substitutions, he should have done it after 15 minutes of that game.
I seem to recall on here, people were rubbishing Kiraly, Fofana, Parker, Burns, Grimmer, Bod and Staff after the game, and as they all played badly it was fair comment. Mac and Hugo got away with it as they hardly touched the ball and LVC is everyones favourite at the moment (me included).
We can disagree I don't ever have an issue with that.
I actually don't see what i want to see, I know I have been vocal on this subject but because he is so underwhelming.
The whole team had a very poor night, personally i thought the center backs did OK but were left horribly exposed.
Where Ruiz was of particular note was that right in front of us he shirked three challenges, and took quite a lot of of abuse from people a bit behind me of a sort that i wouldn't have done. The rest tried very hard, but were awful on the day (it happens), I honestly did not feel his heart was in it at all.
As I say I didn't see that, I saw Burn get out manouvered by Deeney frequently, I saw Parker completely overrun and Fofana have a game where his first touch left him exposed.
Ruiz was just there, not good not worse than anyone else IMHO. If I were Kit, I would have still taken him off though. Overall, and this season only, I like what he brings to the team, even though he is the one player who also irritates me more when he gets it wrong, as he should do better.
Deeney?
He looked good, and when a player like him plays well in a team that is playing as well as watford did on the night it is hard to defend against them.
I agree about parker and fofana... Parker had been one of the highlits for me so far this season but his last coupkle of games were not quite as good as he is capable of... I suspect that might be age catching up.
I agree with both sides of this fresh ruiz debate.
First of all nose, I think most of what you said originally was spot on. His overall contribution has been very underwhelming and he is definitely over hyped by some to the point in which it becomes a bit cringing to read it. The last four years has proved he isn't a superstar, he shows glimpses of a special player but so did facundo sava and his mask, in fact sava gave a lot more return in one year than ruiz has given in 4 and that's not including the price tag.
I felt sorry for ruiz when berbatov was here because it was quite clear they couldn't compliment each other's styles and Berba was always coming deep to dictate what his team mates should be doing. As a result ruiz was suffocated and left with no forward options. I was convinced if played the right way he would come good but even now at a lower level and with the team built around him he's still inconsistent and no better than anyone else.
I do like him or at least I want to like him because I see the talent is there somewhere but he is very frustrating and the fact he has failed to adapt to the pace of our game in 4 years suggests he is wasting both his career and our time by staying. He would be better off in a slower tempo league and we'd be better off with a midfielder or a winger making us able to change the narrow system being played just to cater for him.
I also agree with Tony that you're being very harsh about the Watford game. This is the perfect example of a scapegoat. Ruiz was no worse than the other 10 until he was subbed. This is the type of thing that happened to senderos when we were losing. And ruiz wasn't subbed for being the worst Player, it was just the only player kit felt he could take off to keep some sort of shape. I personally think Fofana should have come off instead because at least ruiz would've been some sort of link between defence and attack even if he is slow.
I think you do understand football nose but your a tad harsh in some respects. But we're all guilty of doing that as supporters, I'm probably too hard on zverotic.
We're supporters, we're at our best when we're moaning lol
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 17, 2014, 06:52:12 PM
I agree with both sides of this fresh ruiz debate.
First of all nose, I think most of what you said originally was spot on. His overall contribution has been very underwhelming and he is definitely over hyped by some to the point in which it becomes a bit cringing to read it. The last four years has proved he isn't a superstar, he shows glimpses of a special player but so did facundo sava and his mask, in fact sava gave a lot more return in one year than ruiz has given in 4 and that's not including the price tag.
I felt sorry for ruiz when berbatov was here because it was quite clear they couldn't compliment each other's styles and Berba was always coming deep to dictate what his team mates should be doing. As a result ruiz was suffocated and left with no forward options. I was convinced if played the right way he would come good but even now at a lower level and with the team built around him he's still inconsistent and no better than anyone else.
I do like him or at least I want to like him because I see the talent is there somewhere but he is very frustrating and the fact he has failed to adapt to the pace of our game in 4 years suggests he is wasting both his career and our time by staying. He would be better off in a slower tempo league and we'd be better off with a midfielder or a winger making us able to change the narrow system being played just to cater for him.
I also agree with Tony that you're being very harsh about the Watford game. This is the perfect example of a scapegoat. Ruiz was no worse than the other 10 until he was subbed. This is the type of thing that happened to senderos when we were losing. And ruiz wasn't subbed for being the worst Player, it was just the only player kit felt he could take off to keep some sort of shape. I personally think Fofana should have come off instead because at least ruiz would've been some sort of link between defence and attack even if he is slow.
I think you do understand football nose but your a tad harsh in some respects. But we're all guilty of doing that as supporters, I'm probably too hard on zverotic.
We're supporters, we're at our best when we're moaning lol
actually I didn't mean to 'scappegoat him' even if that is how it sounds and I do agree the whole team were dreadful.
regarding sendeross, i know he wasn't always an asset and i was a big critic for ages but he won me round because he was so comitted to the cause and gave absolutely everything and in the end I really think we missed him.
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 03:46:08 PM
:005: 049:gif :005: 049:gif :008: 049:gif :008: :005:Quote from: epsomraver on December 17, 2014, 03:31:49 PM
Quote from: FulhamStu on December 17, 2014, 01:17:31 PM
Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 01:11:15 PM
I haven't been involved in a good ruiz debate for a while and it may suprise you to know I do not think him the devil incarnate. However some of the fiction about him is amaziing. For a player of his reputed ability (the most talented player at the club i think I read somewhere above) I rarely notice him do anything devastatingly breathtaking. He did score two great chipped goals.... and one wonder strike last season off the bench. Other than those isolated events, in all this time i can't remeber him really being a major influence in the game.
In possesion he does not hold the ball rather than punt it, he holds the ball because he generally takes far too long in possesion and gets caught out as a result. I recall Ross playing a number of brilliant long passes to Hugo and ruiz in the penalty area, buit not ruiz to them. He is very poor at tackling but quite good at intercepting passes butr as he gets possesion he is so painfully slow in moving andf deciding what to do with the ball it usually counts for little.
Against watford his lack of effort and shirking of challenges and unwillingness to close down opponents was scandalous.
I have never accepted that he is that taleneted, he does have some ability but he generally keeps it to himself, we effectievly play with 10 men because of his inability to keep up with play.
And ask yourself, if he was really that good and after all everyone said about him and the purpoted brilliant world cup he had, why wasn't he snapped up in the close season? Magath didn't rate him so surely he would have been one of the first out of the door,
If he was really any good for our team we wouldn';t still be having this debate.
Ross is brilliant, he contributed from day one. Hugo has no first touch but his effort is exemplary and he is scoring, LVC is a star, Ruiz is lucky to have them around him.
100% agree with all of this post, written by someone who understands football.
Nose understands football 064.gif 064.gif 064.gif 064.gif
Thank you..... I am assuming you are laughing with delight at my brilliance
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Seasons Greetings
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Quote from: nose on December 17, 2014, 10:37:14 PM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 17, 2014, 06:52:12 PM
I agree with both sides of this fresh ruiz debate.
First of all nose, I think most of what you said originally was spot on. His overall contribution has been very underwhelming and he is definitely over hyped by some to the point in which it becomes a bit cringing to read it. The last four years has proved he isn't a superstar, he shows glimpses of a special player but so did facundo sava and his mask, in fact sava gave a lot more return in one year than ruiz has given in 4 and that's not including the price tag.
I felt sorry for ruiz when berbatov was here because it was quite clear they couldn't compliment each other's styles and Berba was always coming deep to dictate what his team mates should be doing. As a result ruiz was suffocated and left with no forward options. I was convinced if played the right way he would come good but even now at a lower level and with the team built around him he's still inconsistent and no better than anyone else.
I do like him or at least I want to like him because I see the talent is there somewhere but he is very frustrating and the fact he has failed to adapt to the pace of our game in 4 years suggests he is wasting both his career and our time by staying. He would be better off in a slower tempo league and we'd be better off with a midfielder or a winger making us able to change the narrow system being played just to cater for him.
I also agree with Tony that you're being very harsh about the Watford game. This is the perfect example of a scapegoat. Ruiz was no worse than the other 10 until he was subbed. This is the type of thing that happened to senderos when we were losing. And ruiz wasn't subbed for being the worst Player, it was just the only player kit felt he could take off to keep some sort of shape. I personally think Fofana should have come off instead because at least ruiz would've been some sort of link between defence and attack even if he is slow.
I think you do understand football nose but your a tad harsh in some respects. But we're all guilty of doing that as supporters, I'm probably too hard on zverotic.
We're supporters, we're at our best when we're moaning lol
actually I didn't mean to 'scappegoat him' even if that is how it sounds and I do agree the whole team were dreadful.
regarding sendeross, i know he wasn't always an asset and i was a big critic for ages but he won me round because he was so comitted to the cause and gave absolutely everything and in the end I really think we missed him.
There we have the problem in this debate . If you are impressed by people who appear to give their all , then you don't rate Ruiz and get frustrated with his apparent lack of commitment .But in football we also need players who can keep cool under pressure. I would suggest that this is Ruiz foremost quality , and as a result of it many don't rate him .
We have had lots of players like senderos who give their all and are forgiven even though they are
poor players . Ruiz plays with his head and is a very intelligent player. I don't think that you can quantify what he does with statistics , because his coolness is vital in our side with so many young players .
He is frustrating and we can see the potential he has , but we can't just slate him because he doesn't live up to that potential , whilst praising those that we can see are poor , but forgive them as they give their all . Seems a tad unfair to reason in this way don't you think ?
... I just can't see it . We wouldn't get anything for him and I think hell stay until the summer and go on a free(which will see a lot more potential takers). There s been a lot of talk on here about us changing our system if he goes . I don't think so . Ruiz takes the pressure off RM , if he went then ross would be the main man to watch in our side.
Cant see who we could replace him with without spending a lot of money , and Ruiz is loyal to Fulham despite having a less than wonderful time with us . I could be wrong but I can't see him going in january .
Fantastic result today and Jims commentary and his comments on Helen ( still don't know how this should be pronounced made me chuckle) .Bring on Bournemouth ! Come on you Lilly whites !
xma2
we could replace from within quite easily if you ask me. david or roberts. or even play woody up top and drop ross back. i hope he stays, but this is not a position i will lose any sleep over. cm or a dm for me is key in this window as our defence is starting to gel together
Ben, David is not even in the squad and Roberts gets the odd 2 minutes and is played wide , so it isn't going to happen ,and wouldn't work either ,sorry .
He was a passenger today. If it wasn't for our yellow cards, he would have come off much earlier. We are accommodating him at the moment.
Quote from: colinwhite on December 20, 2014, 06:47:18 PM
Ben, David is not even in the squad and Roberts gets the odd 2 minutes and is played wide , so it isn't going to happen ,and wouldn't work either ,sorry .
roberts replaced ruiz today did he not? and lots of stuff happens in football, we have seen players frozen out and then return.
ill also add that i reckon kaca could slot in behind the front 2/1 depending on what ross is up to too
Roberts has amazing potential but he isn't ready . Ruiz does a job in ball retention that many people don't appreciate , Roberts has no idea about positioning and team shape (which is normal for an 18 year old ), so it won't happen . Ruiz also is good in the air and and has a sweet left foot (second goal ) and they don't grow on trees .
Irrespective of Ruizs merits or defects my point is that i think Kit will want to hang on to him and it will also suit Ruiz to wait until the summer .
ive already stated that i want him to stay, but the fact is if he does leave in January, then all those traits you mention will be of no help to us. i love how ruiz recycles the ball, but ill take running football all day long over passing football. barcelona bore me to death with there style of football, but i could watch madrid running at defences all day long. so with that in mind id rather watch patrick get hold of it and take players on every time.
I thought Ruiz was very poor today; and my dad (a Chelsea fan) agreed. The game passed him by. Don't get me wrong, I do like Ruiz, but I think we'd be both better off if we went our separate ways.
The anti Ruiz stuff, I was clearly watching a different game, thought he played very well.
Quote from: FPT on December 20, 2014, 07:23:45 PM
I thought Ruiz was very poor today; and my dad (a Chelsea fan) agreed. The game passed him by. Don't get me wrong, I do like Ruiz, but I think we'd be both better off if we went our separate ways.
Are you kidding me " my dad a Chelsea fan agrees"...Oh well that's it official then he has to go !!. Grow some and live by your own opinions son.
Here are mine...Ruiz had a good game, put in a proper shift and we won 4-0.
End off.
Was he booed off today? If so, it's no wonder he's running for the exit.
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 20, 2014, 06:47:21 PM
He was a passenger today. If it wasn't for our yellow cards, he would have come off much earlier. We are accommodating him at the moment.
I know! Only one assist. What a slacker fp.gif
It's amazing how we all see things differently even if some seem a little blinkered.
For me second halve ruiz pulled the strings, including the little cameo with lvc, also just my opinion but the guy has too much class for the championship but I understand why he gets critisised.
Suppose one man's idea of composure and class is another man's idea of lack of passion and laziness.
Quote from: HatterDon on December 20, 2014, 08:36:12 PM
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 20, 2014, 06:47:21 PM
He was a passenger today. If it wasn't for our yellow cards, he would have come off much earlier. We are accommodating him at the moment.
I know! Only one assist. What a slacker fp.gif
Please elaborate on why he played well. An assist doesn't mean you played well.
He was lazy, as per usual. Got in the way of most attacks. Didn't help out defensively when he tracked back. We are putting him in the team for the sake of it.
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 20, 2014, 09:59:59 PM
Quote from: HatterDon on December 20, 2014, 08:36:12 PM
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 20, 2014, 06:47:21 PM
He was a passenger today. If it wasn't for our yellow cards, he would have come off much earlier. We are accommodating him at the moment.
I know! Only one assist. What a slacker fp.gif
Please elaborate on why he played well. An assist doesn't mean you played well.
no, but it does mean he wasnt a passanger. we must be the only fans in the world who slate our attacking players when we get hammered, then slate them some more when we stuff somone. god knows what will happen if we draw our next game 0 0. burning effigys perhaps?
He was completely anonymous today apart from his assist, which is of course why he is in the team, but most of the time he is a frustrating passenger,
I was told by somebody who said he was told by somebody who said he spoke to Patrick Robert's father who told him that he (Pat - not the father) will be replacing Ruiz when he goes whether it's in January or the summer.
I do hope for his sake he does go
Ruiz is a stylish player, if you cannot see it, or choose to ignore it, Coooooool
but...........................
why do some of you keep repeating the lie that he is a poor player ?????
It'a team game and and the team is doing well in most matches. Two points a game since Kit took over is very good and it's now nearly a third of a season.
But of course this board is packed with experts and analysts who always know better than the guy who's in charge. Personally I enjoy the good games and moan about the bad but to imagine that Ruiz, or any other player, isn't contributing to both is nonsense.
Quote from: KCat on December 21, 2014, 09:16:47 AM
I do hope for his sake he does go
Ruiz is a stylish player, if you cannot see it, or choose to ignore it, Coooooool
but...........................
why do some of you keep repeating the lie that he is a poor player ?????
I think everyone can see he has skill and something about him and not as a poor player. What is questioned at times is his commitment, contribution and general performances.
I'm not a fan and will be alright when he leaves. But as much as I have criticised him but I actually think he has done some good things in the last couple of games.
Not mom performances but has been involved in some good things.
I have two issues with him, one is his commitment at times at getting physically involved. I'm not talking chopper Harris type tackles but it's when he clearly bottles out of going for the ball. He has improved in that area but still frustrates me and those sitting in the JH stand.
Secondary is he never seems to bust a gut to get forward. How many times for a player playing behind the strikers do we see him run fast to get into the box. A prime example was last week at Leeds, had ball on left and passed to McCormack close by, but instead of moving ahead and supporting Ross, it was... here's the ball my job is done and just stopped.
He did it numerous times at Brighton as well.
Has skill and is not a poor player in the right circumstances, but at times I still struggle to see what he totally contributes to the cause.
Ruiz had a good game, but those that don't like him will see what you want to see irrespective of what happens.
He has had poor games, but yesterday wasn't one of them
MJG, I agree with some of the things you say ......
However, In 2011 We, Fulham got ourselves a lovely, lovely player, envied by many clubs..........but then Jol, Rene, Felix and fan managed to destroy, dismantle him. I think Kit is working a little magic and we see glimpses of the player that was,
It will take time to undo damage done to the soul of a man.
Quote from: KCat on December 21, 2014, 09:56:00 AM
MJG, I agree with some of the things you say ......
However, In 2011 We, Fulham got ourselves a lovely, lovely player, envied by many clubs..........but then Jol, Rene, Felix and fan managed to destroy, dismantle him. I think Kit is working a little magic and we see glimpses of the player that was,
It will take time to undo damage done to the soul of a man.
Great point. He doesn't seem/most don't perceive him to have any issues at all at International level either.
