Jol: Merged

[Stefano Okaka Chuka]

Irrelevant criticism by a young player who still needs to focus on his game instead of talking about the manager who gave him his break into football like this. Jol is certainly not a long ball merchant and we know it.

[HatterDon]

"I'll get me coat".

Nothing like an over-reaction! We're always crap away from home no matter who we play, what team we select, what manager we have. Just crap.
Surprised you're not used to it yet.

I love how when Jol gets criticized it's always just "one game" or "a few games" when everyone should know that there's a continuing problem with the way Jol selects his team, determines his tactics, fails to retrench at half time, and makes interesting substitutions. We had the same thing the last 2.5 seasons that Schwarzer was here. Every time anyone moaned about his crap distribution and his flapping and hesitation, we were told it was over-reaction to just one game.

Rubbish. Now, I applaud Jol for going for it away from home in terms of his team selection today, but there should have been a couple of substitutions at half time that would have made the difference. We had them on their heels and dropped into slow motion. Their manager -- on the other hand -- made aggressive, attacking substitutions and almost ran us off the pitch.

So, yeah, I applaud Jol for his initial team selection, but I'm tired of slow motion sideways Martin Jol Sexy Football. And yeah, I know, we always suck on the road, it's only one game, and I'm overreacting.

[Deanothefulhamfan]

After last nights selection I have given up with Jol.... The fact he played a strong side and we still struggled is beyond a joke. Burton are not a bad league 2 side, but they are league 2 nevertheless.... I didnt see the game but everyone is saying the same things for me to think I didnt miss much.

Our team selection, tactics and performance are not good enough.

[justinfromga]

"I'll get me coat".

Nothing like an over-reaction! We're always crap away from home no matter who we play, what team we select, what manager we have. Just crap.
Surprised you're not used to it yet.

I love how when Jol gets criticized it's always just "one game" or "a few games" when everyone should know that there's a continuing problem with the way Jol selects his team, determines his tactics, fails to retrench at half time, and makes interesting substitutions. We had the same thing the last 2.5 seasons that Schwarzer was here. Every time anyone moaned about his crap distribution and his flapping and hesitation, we were told it was over-reaction to just one game.

Rubbish. Now, I applaud Jol for going for it away from home in terms of his team selection today, but there should have been a couple of substitutions at half time that would have made the difference. We had them on their heels and dropped into slow motion. Their manager -- on the other hand -- made aggressive, attacking substitutions and almost ran us off the pitch.

So, yeah, I applaud Jol for his initial team selection, but I'm tired of slow motion sideways Martin Jol Sexy Football. And yeah, I know, we always suck on the road, it's only one game, and I'm overreacting.

You know...the frustrating thing I find about being a Fulham fan is that a lot of the "old timers" seem to have this romantic view about how great it would be if Fulham just dropped back down into League 1 and finished mid-table every year and were just the neighborhood team that was fun to watch.  It's a losers mentality.

Fulham CAN be successful.  It wasn't that long ago that we were making the great run through the Europa tournament.  It wasn't that long ago we were a threat for the top ten every season.  Heck...even Jol had a top ten season here!

What we've seen since the middle of last spring is out and out poor play.  It's not because we lack the players (Berbatov, Bent, Taarabt, Ruiz, Parker, Hangeland, Riise, Hughes, Riether, Dejagah, Kaca, Boatang...all full national team members in the past).  We have a manager who has to play HIS way and can not change HIS tactics to fit the team he has.  It's the Jol way or no way at all and, by god, if we go down playing that way then we go down.  At least Fulham will still be the jolly ol' neighborhood team that never wins anything.

Jol needs to be shown the door.  As said above...it's become far too many "just this one match."  Something has to change.

[Roberty]

http://www.insidefutbol.com/2013/08/22/under-martin-jol-it-was-give-the-ball-to-luis-suarez-and-hope-christian-eriksen-feels-ajax-style-of-play-better-under-frank-de-boer/96493/

Says it all  093.gif

The only thing it says it that because Ajax have sold Suarez and Ruiz they have to play a different style of play. Maybe you did not read it to the end of the page?

[RaySmith]

We should have been out of sight with the chances we created before Burton came back into the game.

Credit to Fulham for a battling display, to draw level in extra time, before going on to win the shoot out.

Well done to the players and to Jol.

[Bassey the warrior]

Certainly, he's a man with no plan B.

How ironic that you should accuse Jol of having no plan B after a game in which he changed the formation from a lone striker to a front-two and saw the second striker fire our equalising goal.

Really? His plan B was to wait until the last 7 minutes to change the way we played. Didn't think it would be a good idea in say the first 70 minutes of the game before they decided to actually have a go at us? I think a manager has to play the best tactics for the team he has against the opposition they play. Jol finds that very hard to do.

The accusation was that Jol has no plan B. In order to refute this, it is not necessary to consider whether he deploys that plan at the most appropriate moment; it is enough simply to show that he does have a plan B.

Certainly, he's a man with no plan B. I feel that Jol has to sign a creative midfielder or he will likely go sooner rather than later. Our midfield is not creative enough thus the defence will start to skip the midfield and we don't have a target man.

How ironic that you should accuse Jol of having no plan B after a game in which he changed the formation from a lone striker to a front-two and saw the second striker fire our equalising goal.

I agree that, despite signing Parker, we still seem to want for a player who can pick a pass that opens up the opposition's defence. However, I disagree with your inference that our defenders will 'skip the midfield'. Firstly, it didn't happen last season even though we had exactly the same problem. Secondly, as you point out, we have no target man to offer our defenders the incentive to hit the ball long each time.

We didn't change the way we played. Not so much a change of tactics as a change of player. Rodallega was very composed, uncharacteristically to be honest. He showed superb technique so is perhaps deserving of the super sub role rather than dropping out the picture completely as a 3 goal a season striker usually does.

And of course as was pointed out this happened very late in the game, why not try to win it in 90 minutes and give the players more rest for the weekend? Admittedly we created a fair few chances second half but it was a case of hope for the best rather than the more ambitious let's increase the number of goalscorers on the pitch. The best managers are proactive with their tactical changes, not reactive.

[MrProphet]

Every time we play under Jol I can't understand what the game plan is and worse still clearly neither can the players.
We are so poorly organised have no shape when we lose the ball and have lost the ability to defend.

The most frustrating thing with Jol is that he plays a high line (with no pace in defence and look what Liverpool and Sturridge did to us) this closes the space in midfield which is made even worse by the fact he continues to play berbatov on his own up ffront who drops back in to midfield inviting the opposition to push up. We have no threat in behind and our opponents know this and push further and further up the pitch.
He is clueless and might I add disliked by all his previous teams

[Bassey the warrior]

Every time we play under Jol I can't understand what the game plan is and worse still clearly neither can the players.
We are so poorly organised have no shape when we lose the ball and have lost the ability to defend.

The most frustrating thing with Jol is that he plays a high line (with no pace in defence and look what Liverpool and Sturridge did to us) this closes the space in midfield which is made even worse by the fact he continues to play berbatov on his own up ffront who drops back in to midfield inviting the opposition to push up. We have no threat in behind and our opponents know this and push further and further up the pitch.
He is clueless and might I add disliked by all his previous teams

Not sure we play a high line, to me we play quite deep, too deep in fact.

[Artful Dodger]

Every time we play under Jol I can't understand what the game plan is and worse still clearly neither can the players.
We are so poorly organised have no shape when we lose the ball and have lost the ability to defend.

The most frustrating thing with Jol is that he plays a high line (with no pace in defence and look what Liverpool and Sturridge did to us) this closes the space in midfield which is made even worse by the fact he continues to play berbatov on his own up ffront who drops back in to midfield inviting the opposition to push up. We have no threat in behind and our opponents know this and push further and further up the pitch.
He is clueless and might I add disliked by all his previous teams

Not sure we play a high line, to me we play quite deep, too deep in fact.

Point proven....no-one knows what our tactics are (including the players) except they are normally the wrong ones!!

[Holders]

"I'll get me coat".

Nothing like an over-reaction! We're always crap away from home no matter who we play, what team we select, what manager we have. Just crap.
Surprised you're not used to it yet.

Especially in the cups.

Yes, like in 1975, remember that?

[grandad]

It´s the easiest thing in the world to say sack the manager. Whether it be Jol, Wenger, Pardew etc. In our case, as it´s the only relevance to me, the posters who want our manager out never come up with a realistic alternative. Even if we were to attract someone he would be faced with exactly the same financial restraints & there would be a further upheaval of players coming & going. No, we need stability over the next few years.
We have Jol & he & the club are fully focused on the future. Unless you have oodles of money & you can buy your way to the top, you have to build the next generation by the use of the Academy. The proof is there that we have one of the best in the country.
The youngsters on the whole are not yet ready to step up. It will be another 2 -3 years before a select few will be good enough. Every home grown player that makes the grade will save us millions in the transfer market.

[Deanothefulhamfan]

We have one of the best academys in the country, yet we have a manager who doesnt beleove in youth. Im sorry but I disagree, a new manager wouldnt need to buy extra players, we have a good squad, but we have a manager who is tactically clueless.

He has had time to get all his players, yet we are still seeing poor performance week in week out. He picks the wrong team, infact he doesnt know what his best team is, and the team do not know how to play together. We have no shape or orginisation and we are currently playing the worst football since Sanchez.  His starting line up yesterday was a joke, and the fact we almost went out is beyond belief. I have read so many views that Burton sat back and expected us to attack, and when we refused to go at them they gained confidence. His excuses bore me and his lineups / substiutions are so poor. We could well be saying we are too good to go down, but just look at leeds etc. The longer Jol is at the helm the more I worry

[Steven Ageroad]

I think we have exhausted all the whys and wherefores of the game and the short season so far.
So to take this discussion to the next level, if Jol was to go, who would you have that is available to replace him? and please don't mention Curbushley.

[Deanothefulhamfan]

Its very tricky when you say who is available. Because why should we only look at available managers.... Teams approach managers that are with other clubs all the time?

I would go for Di matteo as "available" but there are plenty of Managers with other clubs who might find Fulham as an attractive offer.... Khan would bring in a big name

[Classic94]

I'm afraid that last nights debacle has become the norm over the past 12 months. During this time, I could count our good games on one hand. I'd hoped that issues of direction, creativity & leadership would have been addressed over the summer, but here we are on August 28th with the same concerns. Our football is cautious, one-dimensional & just incredibly dull; a far-cry from the fluid, attacking play that we were promised. For all our possession, we seem incapable of mustering chances - even against League 2 opposition. It's a very sad situation, particularly as our manager seems incapable of reverting to plan B, or even perfecting plan A (whatever that is). Aside from Jol's tactical failings, he may also lack the ability to unite the dressing-room, to inspire belief amongst our players, and to mould individuals into a cohesive outfit, because, at present, we are playing like a group of strangers plucked from Bishops park.

[fulhamfever]

If you asked me before kicking a ball at the start of the season would you take a Away win at Sunderland a home loss to Arsenal and a place in the 3rd Round of the Carling Cup I would say thats a good start. And to play a under pressure Newcastle at the weekend Yeah I would say its a heck of a start to the season and with 5 days of Transfer window to go lets see what it brings.

[Jimpav]

If you asked me before kicking a ball at the start of the season would you take a Away win at Sunderland a home loss to Arsenal and a place in the 3rd Round of the Carling Cup I would say thats a good start. And to play a under pressure Newcastle at the weekend Yeah I would say its a heck of a start to the season and with 5 days of Transfer window to go lets see what it brings.

This is a bit like saying you are pleased because you found a fiver (at the bottom of a septic tank).

[fulhamfever]

If you asked me before kicking a ball at the start of the season would you take a Away win at Sunderland a home loss to Arsenal and a place in the 3rd Round of the Carling Cup I would say thats a good start. And to play a under pressure Newcastle at the weekend Yeah I would say its a heck of a start to the season and with 5 days of Transfer window to go lets see what it brings.

This is a bit like saying you are pleased because you found a fiver (at the bottom of a septic tank).

No it aint mate look at Norwich spent god knows how much they have a draw and a loss after 2 games and a place in the 3rd Round. Which one would you take?

[The Old Count]

I don't understandn all this 'Jol should stay because no one can suggest who to replace him with' stuff.

Southampton have found a good manager, Swansea got Laudrup, we found Roy H, even Hughes was decent. There are still good managers out there.

Question is, does everyone think Jol is the best we can get and can he take us forward?