Parker Out

[Spirit of 2000]

Never liked Parker. As a coach, as a player; as a person he is monotone and lacks any charisma.
His starting 11 is often hard to fathom, tactically naive, questionable formations, poor substitutions, no fire or passion. He stands there with his hands in his pocket hoping...
He has hawked himself around nearly every London club as a player; Charlton, Chelsea, West Ham, Spurs and finally, us. Like a farewell tour, we were silly enough to get him at the end of his career, and then, get him back at the start of his managerial one.
He did his primary coaching at Spurs, is that not a big enough hint? The only reason he is with us as Manager (or Head Coach if you like) is because Spurs and none of the other London clubs he has been with offered him the top job!! We did.

He is not a long loyal servant of Fulham. He took his pension with us and then got an apprentiship here too! Double whammy.
He needs to go - ASAP - or I will re-post this in 8 weeks time with my head in my hands.

A number of people have criticised this part of your post but I don't think anyone can reasonably disagree with any of it

0001.jpeg :plus one:

Not a Fulham legend by a country mile. Although this isnt a pre-requisite to be a decent manager, he isnt that either,  stubborn, dull football, tactically poor, questionable selections. The sooner we see the back of him, the better and I for one wont miss him one Iota. Parker out!

[ScalleysDad]

Now of course I could be wrong because I was not in the room but didn't Parker come here as a number two leaving his cushy number at Spurs, didn't he hold the respect of the changing room through all the carnage, effectively got promoted from within,(something many Clubs aspire to), with the significant support of Khan Snr and key players and during this period am I right in thinking there were no top jobs going at Chelsea, West Ham, the big gig at Wembley or Charlton. Other than that you might be onto something but the list of potential managers is shocking.


As an aside yes Parker did finish off his 'badges' at Spurs and within The FA Coaches Association he was highly regarded when he was doing them. Something must be going wrong though if we are only top six almost halfway through the season and halfway into a new project. Again I was'nt in the room but did'nt Bristol, Forest and QPR lose to so called lesser or comparable teams this saturday.

[Sgt Fulham]

Something must be going wrong though if we are only top six almost halfway through the season and halfway into a new project. Again I was'nt in the room but did'nt Bristol, Forest and QPR lose to so called lesser or comparable teams this saturday.

With all due respect, how much did those teams spend on their squad? What are the expectations of those teams? Are their performances way below what the individual players are capable of?

[ScalleysDad]

Something must be going wrong though if we are only top six almost halfway through the season and halfway into a new project. Again I was'nt in the room but did'nt Bristol, Forest and QPR lose to so called lesser or comparable teams this saturday.

With all due respect, how much did those teams spend on their squad? What are the expectations of those teams? Are their performances way below what the individual players are capable of?

Did we do the money spent topic a while ago? Cav and Knockaert might well be on big money but their impact has been inconsistent. Mawson was a hefty fee but again he has not really proved that value, with the caveat of the injuries of course.
Expectations? Well we just had the second major screw up in five years so top six would have been a fair target with building blocks put in along the way. Imho charging full tilt for an instant return to the Prem with journeyman, an ageing squad in key areas and the debacle of the on and off pitch fiasco of last season still ringing loud was/is folly. With this team we would be slaughtered most weeks which be improved if we turn our track record with key purchases right around. Sheffield United fans must be loving it. No superstars, no baggage but plenty of grit and a style of play founded on building blocks.
Performances dropping. Yes but some have been given a false starting point. Knockaert may well have been class under Hughton in the Championship a couple of seasons ago but that was a couple of seasons ago and his personal issues aside he has'nt really fired on all four since. Ream was our Player of the Year with 60% of the vote barely two years ago but he might lose out to Hector in January. Time is harsh. Cav, Mawson, Reid, Reed, Knockaert and even Onamah at full tilt would be fantastic but perhaps it's just not the right mix. Certainly the current back line is left really exposed when the big money does'nt track back.

[Sgt Fulham]

Cav - 26
Mawson - 25
Reid - 26
Knockaert - 28
Cairney - 28
Mitro - 25

I hope you're not referring to the age of our players, most of whom should be in their prime. Any manager worth their salt could at least run top 2 close with this team, though the talent there should be winning the league. Any other team would lick their lips at one of those players let alone a team of them. Club turmoil or not it should be men against boys. Newcastle were in turmoil when they bought the league, the difference was that they had a competent manager. It's the managers job to get the best out of the players and make sure they are performing and tracking back. Hughton was able to do this with Knockaert, as you mentioned, so why not Mr Inspirational Scott Parker?

Players dont just become crap. To me it's as clear as day that they either dont know what they are meant to be doing, or more likely dont  believe in it.

I agree we would get slaughtered in the Premier League, but we would get another go at the summer transfer market, and I would hope that the Khans had learnt their lesson.

[ScalleysDad]

Oh great. Now a game of top trumps.
Odoi, Ream, Kmac ........ "Key areas"

[Sgt Fulham]

Oh great. Now a game of top trumps.
Odoi, Ream, Kmac ........ "Key areas"

Nice post. Might want to include some actual content next time.

[Spirit of 2000]

Cav - 26
Mawson - 25
Reid - 26
Knockaert - 28
Cairney - 28
Mitro - 25

I hope you're not referring to the age of our players, most of whom should be in their prime. Any manager worth their salt could at least run top 2 close with this team, though the talent there should be winning the league. Any other team would lick their lips at one of those players let alone a team of them. Club turmoil or not it should be men against boys. Newcastle were in turmoil when they bought the league, the difference was that they had a competent manager. It's the managers job to get the best out of the players and make sure they are performing and tracking back. Hughton was able to do this with Knockaert, as you mentioned, so why not Mr Inspirational Scott Parker?

Players dont just become crap. To me it's as clear as day that they either dont know what they are meant to be doing, or more likely dont  believe in it.

I agree we would get slaughtered in the Premier League, but we would get another go at the summer transfer market, and I would hope that the Khans had learnt their lesson.

There is no plan B - plan A isn't working, there is no direction, little drive shown maybe due to the listless style of play, selection is questionable, tactically Parker is out done most weeks these days - this squad should be top 3 this division, agree though that we would be destroyed in the premier, but again agree that gives us another chance to sort things in the summer - starting with defensive stability. Without Mitrovic we would be lower half - sorry I see nobody else to take the blame for all the above than Parker. Lose to Leeds and he must be gone. Those 4 games we won were scrappy & a long way from convincing and papered over cracks.

[ScalleysDad]

Oh great. Now a game of top trumps.
Odoi, Ream, Kmac ........ "Key areas"

Nice post. Might want to include some actual content next time.

Blimey. It's a real bugger life gets in the way. Let's see. For a start I did not refer to any of the players as being crap or becoming crap. So. Kmac and Ream must be 32 going on 33, the former seen to be slowing up already, and Odoi hit thirty last year so with my maths he is going to be 31 maybe closing in on 32. Go forward a year and the rigours of Championship football let alone the Premiership will tell and these "Key areas" will be exposed time and time again. As I said time is harsh.

[Mullers OG]

We've had too many managers given too little time.  If you keep on chopping and changing no-one ever feels able to do the job properly or feels secure.  If results don't improve then there will have to come a time when the board acts but, for me, the time hasn't yet approached.

My main gripe with this current team is that they are so dull.  There's nothing to get excited about and no one player who you feel worth traveling to watch.  A few years ago there were Dempsey, Duff, Murphy - one can go on.  Before that Hayles, Saha and Boa.  Now we have to watch a team including Onomah and Kamara, neither of whom are remotely good enough to be seen in an FFC shirt.

The only possible exception I would make is for Kebano who has waited patiently for his chance, and waited far too long, but who looks up for it, goes forward at pace and attacks his full back.

Parker needs to get the supporters back onside and quickly.  Otherwise even people like myself who want some continuity will be calling for change.

[Sgt Fulham]

Oh great. Now a game of top trumps.
Odoi, Ream, Kmac ........ "Key areas"

Nice post. Might want to include some actual content next time.

Blimey. It's a real bugger life gets in the way. Let's see. For a start I did not refer to any of the players as being crap or becoming crap. So. Kmac and Ream must be 32 going on 33, the former seen to be slowing up already, and Odoi hit thirty last year so with my maths he is going to be 31 maybe closing in on 32. Go forward a year and the rigours of Championship football let alone the Premiership will tell and these "Key areas" will be exposed time and time again. As I said time is harsh.

My point was to keep it respectful. If you dont have time to address my points then post when you can, I'm not sat here with a timer.

Now to your post. I am not denying that we have some older players like Kmac, Ream, and Odoi. However, with the exception of Ream these are not key players. Kmac was, and we miss his leadership but he is no longer first choice. Christie can cover Odoi and is more than capable in the Championship. Team's weaknesses are not caused by age. We have weaknesses in key areas, but our version of a weakness would be acceptable by the standards of almost every team in this league. The whole team (perhaps bar Mitro and Rodak) is underperforming and that is a sign of poor management.

[Statto]

Age this season

Ream 31-32
Odoi 31
McDonald 30-31
MLM 29-30
Arter 29-30

Not a single one of them is "past it" for the position they play and at most two, but arguably none (when Hector arrives) of them are in our best XI.

All of them are at least a year younger than Ronaldo was when Juventus paid £100m for him.

I cannot be bothered to work out the average age of our team but I'd be astounded if it's above average.

I'd also love to compare it to the Europe league squad which was almost entirely that age or older.

We simply do not, by any stretch of the imagination, have "an ageing squad"

It's frankly laughable how much some people will try to warp the truth to fudge together something that resembles an excuse for how crap Parker is doing   

[ScalleysDad]

"An ageing squad in key areas" is not the same as an ageing squad full stop. I named the players I thought we should be thinking about 'reinforcing' and they are all fairly close to my guesstimate ages. Happy birthday to Tim Ream who was thirty one in October apparently. He might have got some fudge as a present who knows. Now of course thirty one is not too old if you are really good but he is just about good on a good day although he has the important caveat of the rest of the defence not exactly shining. With the arrival of Hector you are writing off five of the current squad, if I understand it correctly, so is that not a sign of a weak squad? I think we would be happier if we all knew Hector would have to fight hard for a starting place when you consider we signed him twenty odd games ago.
I have not questioned the average age of the team, like you I can't really be bothered, but I like the fact we have Rodak, Sess developing within the first team squad set up, youngsters on the bench and rumours linking us with decent youngsters elsewhere.......... building blocks perhaps?
Interesting point regarding the Europa squad. How many of the current squad would get in it to make it better?
Warping the truth?


Sgt Fulham. Yeah you are right for which I apologise.

[Statto]

"An ageing squad in key areas" is not the same as an ageing squad full stop.

Fine but the bench is not a "key area"

With the arrival of Hector you are writing off five of the current squad, if I understand it correctly, so is that not a sign of a weak squad?

No, I'm saying having a young squad with a few subs in the latter part of their prime is not anywhere near having "an ageing squad in key areas"

Interesting point regarding the Europa squad. How many of the current squad would get in it to make it better?

Laughable, again, that you would even begin to think it relevant, in a debate about whether we're good enough for promotion from the second tier, that the current squad is not as good as the squad that made the European cup final

[ScalleysDad]

Hang on a sec Statto. You raised the Europa, I simply followed it along as it is a point of interest in the current debate about team/squad strength and depth. Part of the debate is how good some people think it is and that Parker is not getting enough out of them. There are others that feel the squad has some flaws and thus is not all conquering. We have done the comparisons on who would walk into a Prem team or a top six Championship team and how we miss Fredericks but we have'nt done Hangaland versus Mawson or an in form BZ verses Mitro. In the context of the debate on how good this squad is, or is'nt, another comparison might show that we have not evolved much at all and the Khan legacy currently hangs on two disastrous periods in our history with a third in the wings.
However this Parker Out debate is getting school playground stuff. I support Khans appointment that's it. You clearly don't. That's fine.

[Woolly Mammoth]

I reckon after the last three matches and the results they entailed, that we desperately need a massive game from every single player against Leeds to get back on the horse, it's even more important that we give them a bloody nose.

[Spirit of 2000]

Hang on a sec Statto. You raised the Europa, I simply followed it along as it is a point of interest in the current debate about team/squad strength and depth. Part of the debate is how good some people think it is and that Parker is not getting enough out of them. There are others that feel the squad has some flaws and thus is not all conquering. We have done the comparisons on who would walk into a Prem team or a top six Championship team and how we miss Fredericks but we have'nt done Hangaland versus Mawson or an in form BZ verses Mitro. In the context of the debate on how good this squad is, or is'nt, another comparison might show that we have not evolved much at all and the Khan legacy currently hangs on two disastrous periods in our history with a third in the wings.
However this Parker Out debate is getting school playground stuff. I support Khans appointment that's it. You clearly don't. That's fine.

Hmmmm ... no, Statto makes a relevant point. Why even attempt to compare a squad that finished 7th in the premier and reached a major European final to a side who's remit was to get promoted from the 2nd tier? (A squad many in & outside the club believed to be packed full of quality for THIS LEVEL and one that has underperformed) It's chalk & cheese. The squad may be unbalanced in part and to a small degree there's some slight oversight from Tony Khan's perspective but the fact this squad has underachieved, is as unbalanced as it seems & doesn't gel as a unit is down mostly to the manager/coach who's job it is to get the best out of the players at his disposal. I can easily argue that the likes of Cavaleiro & Knockaert are underperforming as they thrive in a side that attacks with more urgency & rapidity, that Mitro is often isolated and compromised due to the way Parker sets us up. Similar questions can be asked about selection and deployment of roles in midfield & defence. It all seems so very badly coinceived. I've seldom seen a manager so often tactically out-done as I have with Parker.

[toshes mate]

I am more pragmatic about Fulham's set up under the Khans, and measure performance across the various operators who may be seen to have an effect on the Club's success.  Significantly under the Khans I have not seen a capacity to build a squad rather than buy a squad, the former being a markedly better value for money exercise.  We have sold, not consolidated loans, or lost too many good assets for my liking, even when they have worked if not to perfection but as close as you are likely to get.  Jokanovic dealt with that by suggesting TK should get on with his job and leave team management to him, commenting on TK's choices via his team picks.  Ranieri's time with TK is largely confusing; promises unfulfilled.  Parker, we are told, participated, and yet wasn't there much confusion on that last day of the window?  And so, in all the time TK has managed recruitment nobody has had a particularly clear concept of team building rather than buying.  Jokanovic, via his longevity, probably got closest to a solution - let TK get on with it, but the last two summers prove what a tough job recruitment is even when you have loads of money.  Better to build slowly but surely and waste as little resources as you can.

Parker may be a poor coach but only time can prove that, and would you really trust TK to find us a halfway decent replacement given his track record?  Now if FFC were to sign a top class DoF, could that start a proper building job by really having a finger on the pulses that matter? 

[Spirit of 2000]

I am more pragmatic about Fulham's set up under the Khans, and measure performance across the various operators who may be seen to have an effect on the Club's success.  Significantly under the Khans I have not seen a capacity to build a squad rather than buy a squad, the former being a markedly better value for money exercise.  We have sold, not consolidated loans, or lost too many good assets for my liking, even when they have worked if not to perfection but as close as you are likely to get.  Jokanovic dealt with that by suggesting TK should get on with his job and leave team management to him, commenting on TK's choices via his team picks.  Ranieri's time with TK is largely confusing; promises unfulfilled.  Parker, we are told, participated, and yet wasn't there much confusion on that last day of the window?  And so, in all the time TK has managed recruitment nobody has had a particularly clear concept of team building rather than buying.  Jokanovic, via his longevity, probably got closest to a solution - let TK get on with it, but the last two summers prove what a tough job recruitment is even when you have loads of money.  Better to build slowly but surely and waste as little resources as you can.

Parker may be a poor coach but only time can prove that, and would you really trust TK to find us a halfway decent replacement given his track record?  Now if FFC were to sign a top class DoF, could that start a proper building job by really having a finger on the pulses that matter?

Largely agree with all of that. A squad built over time will also have those very important ingredients of chemistry & team spirit over one chucked together with constant purchases & loans. In such a system (which I would prefer to see), youngsters like O'Riley would be getting their chance and we would be scouring the lower leagues, buying & giving players a chance to develop and come through (Where does the next Horsefield or Finnan come from otherwise) - the loans are a quick & relatively risk free way to try & obtain instant success, but mean every season you're changing half your side. A new DOF or at least TK recognising his lack of in depth knowledge of football & the English game and recruiting a right hand man who has that knowledge would be a step forward.

However not withstanding the above I stand firmly by my assertion that Parker should be getting a lot more from what he's been given. The owners should seriously entertain the merits of a more organic squad growth though.

[ScalleysDad]

Hang on a sec Statto. You raised the Europa, I simply followed it along as it is a point of interest in the current debate about team/squad strength and depth. Part of the debate is how good some people think it is and that Parker is not getting enough out of them. There are others that feel the squad has some flaws and thus is not all conquering. We have done the comparisons on who would walk into a Prem team or a top six Championship team and how we miss Fredericks but we have'nt done Hangaland versus Mawson or an in form BZ verses Mitro. In the context of the debate on how good this squad is, or is'nt, another comparison might show that we have not evolved much at all and the Khan legacy currently hangs on two disastrous periods in our history with a third in the wings.
However this Parker Out debate is getting school playground stuff. I support Khans appointment that's it. You clearly don't. That's fine.

Hmmmm ... no, Statto makes a relevant point. Why even attempt to compare a squad that finished 7th in the premier and reached a major European final to a side who's remit was to get promoted from the 2nd tier? (A squad many in & outside the club believed to be packed full of quality for THIS LEVEL and one that has underperformed) It's chalk & cheese. The squad may be unbalanced in part and to a small degree there's some slight oversight from Tony Khan's perspective but the fact this squad has underachieved, is as unbalanced as it seems & doesn't gel as a unit is down mostly to the manager/coach who's job it is to get the best out of the players at his disposal. I can easily argue that the likes of Cavaleiro & Knockaert are underperforming as they thrive in a side that attacks with more urgency & rapidity, that Mitro is often isolated and compromised due to the way Parker sets us up. Similar questions can be asked about selection and deployment of roles in midfield & defence. It all seems so very badly coinceived. I've seldom seen a manager so often tactically out-done as I have with Parker.

Jeeeeezus.
Linked to the discussion point that this squad might not be good enough, is underperforming or some notice needs to be given to some players getting on a bit I responded to,

"I'd also love to compare it to the Europe league squad which was almost entirely that age or older"

I called that an interesting point, as any comparison with that team would be, but I did not over analyse it, I just posed the question which would probably have the same answers as recent questions on a similar theme. Sorry to intrude on your forum.