Vaccine

[S.F.Sorrow]

By how much is it lower? 99.7% of people who get covid recover.

Unless we start seeing far more deaths following vaccinations you can probably add a couple of decimals to that figure. All vaccines have side effects and the evidence suggests that we've seen deaths from at least AstraZenaca but the risk is still FAR lower than covid.

[SP]

It seems I've developed 'Covid Toe' - that's a new one to me!

[blingo]

It seems I've developed 'Covid Toe' - that's a new one to me!

It's related to foot and mouth lol

[shepperton white]

Well Sorrow in answer to your post, the French and Italians have caved in and are now approving AZ vaccine

[Plodder]

By how much is it lower? 99.7% of people who get covid recover.

Unless we start seeing far more deaths following vaccinations you can probably add a couple of decimals to that figure. All vaccines have side effects and the evidence suggests that we've seen deaths from at least AstraZenaca but the risk is still FAR lower than covid.

I don't see any serious evidence to date that we have seen deaths "from AstraZeneca".  A handful of people (single figures out of tens of millions worldwide) have died after being innoculated with the Astrazeneca vaccine. Since the vaccination programmes in each country began, hundreds of thousands of people have died from natural causes, and inevitably some will die shortly after being vaccinated.  I'll agree that it is not possible to deny categorically the very faint possibility that vaccination was the cause of the few deaths to date, but it seems far more likely to be a coincidence than the cause.  I think you wrote in an earlier message that the risk of death from Covid (exceedingly low) outweighed the risk of death from vaccination (microscopically low or non-existent), and I agree with that.

[Aaron]

It sounds like the format is somewhat different here in Northern Ireland.

I had my first dose last week (Pfizer BioNTech) and my second one is scheduled for May 20th. 

I'm 38 with no underlying conditions but I'm technically a carer so I was (semi-surprisingly) able to book it.  I actually felt pretty bad about what felt like jumping the queue, but I figured the rationale behind it was that if I go down with the disease there's someone (two people actually) who are left in a lot of trouble as a result, so it felt like the right move.

It seems that they've now closed that loophole though as they requested absolutely zero proof that you qualified as a carer, you just checked a box and that was that. 

There was barely a single person in the vaccination centre who looked over 50 on the day I went, so they must have had a shocking uptake of people exploiting the system.  One woman mentioned that she, her husband and daughter had all been vaccinated on the same day which sounded a bit suss.. I know of someone else who decided they qualified as a carer on the grounds that their daughter's boyfriend's father hurt his back a couple of years ago.  This was despite barely knowing the man, having not so much as even given him a bunch of grapes while he was in the hospital much less been involved in his rehabilitation AND living abroad at the same time?! 

Sounds pretty convincing to me..

[S.F.Sorrow]

By how much is it lower? 99.7% of people who get covid recover.

Unless we start seeing far more deaths following vaccinations you can probably add a couple of decimals to that figure. All vaccines have side effects and the evidence suggests that we've seen deaths from at least AstraZenaca but the risk is still FAR lower than covid.

I don't see any serious evidence to date that we have seen deaths "from AstraZeneca".  A handful of people (single figures out of tens of millions worldwide) have died after being innoculated with the Astrazeneca vaccine. Since the vaccination programmes in each country began, hundreds of thousands of people have died from natural causes, and inevitably some will die shortly after being vaccinated.  I'll agree that it is not possible to deny categorically the very faint possibility that vaccination was the cause of the few deaths to date, but it seems far more likely to be a coincidence than the cause.  I think you wrote in an earlier message that the risk of death from Covid (exceedingly low) outweighed the risk of death from vaccination (microscopically low or non-existent), and I agree with that.

Not just in an earlier post but in the one you quoted.

There may not be conclusive evidence that Astrazeneca has has caused deaths but with a growing number of reports of people developing extremely rare and life threatening symptoms shortly after being innoculated with Astrazeneca it's starting to look very likely. We're not just talking about blod clots here but blot clots combined with low platelet counts and bleeding. People HAVE died from this and the growing number of reported cases strongly suggest a link with Astrazeneca.

Still, like I said before: I'm not a vaccine sceptic and I will gladly get the vaccine I'm offered. The risk from ANY of the available vaccines is far lower than covid itself. But at this stage I would personally prefer any other than Astrazeneca if I had a choice (which I don't). Not just because of potentially (but extremely rare) more serious side effects than the other vaccines but because az is reported to be less effective (or possibly not effective at all) against the South African variant. Which means getting another vaccine later with potentially more side effects. But then again, that's probably a very likely scenario with ANY of the current vaccines.

[blingo]

We may be missing the point here. We have left the EU, there were problems with supply. The vaccine is British. Do the sums, its really not very difficult.

Masks? They have stopped nothing at all, but they have given governments a lovely little income stream, whilst screwing poor families out of the little cash they have.

Sorry people but all of this stinks to me.

[FFCFOREVER]

We may be missing the point here. We have left the EU, there were problems with supply. The vaccine is British. Do the sums, its really not very difficult.

Masks? They have stopped nothing at all, but they have given governments a lovely little income stream, whilst screwing poor families out of the little cash they have.

Sorry people but all of this stinks to me.

Agreed

[mrmicawbers]

It seems to me there are a few posters who don't want to take it.Fair enough but let everyone who does want to get vaccinated and get the country back to some normality get on with it.We don't need your anti tax and sentiments thanks.Europe are playing politics with their citizens lives purely because they have messed up badly.Funny I was a remainer
thank God we got out.

[Woolly Mammoth]

I never ever thought that one day I would walk into a bank wearing a mask.

[Willham]

The biggest reason this was a large concern is because covid has caused a lot of deaths through blood clots, and the rare vaccine deaths have been blood clots too, because of this link and 2 people dying, who one had been administered the jab 6 days before death and one 11 days. One in Germany and another in Austria.
I found one report that stated it was the same batch but I dont fully trust the source and nothing else seems to say this other than Austria returned a batch,
AstraZ themselves released a statement saying over their data they found no higher chance of blood clots, actually seemed to find less than what would be expected from a normal group.

But as someone mentioned earlier AstraZ have shown they will talk up their products, lost an incredibly large lawsuit for recommending use of their products for ailments and illnesses that the FDA havent approved.

In other words the FDA hadnt tested an agreed the medication actually did the job the company claimed it did.

[Willham]

I never ever thought that one day I would walk into a bank wearing a mask.

Only in my dreams.
But they'd be a getaway car outside

[alfie]

We may be missing the point here. We have left the EU, there were problems with supply. The vaccine is British. Do the sums, its really not very difficult.

Masks? They have stopped nothing at all, but they have given governments a lovely little income stream, whilst screwing poor families out of the little cash they have.

Sorry people but all of this stinks to me.

How do you know that masks stopped nothing?, if I'm talking with you face to face with a covering over my nose and mouth it's going to stop me spewing stuff all over you, whether it can stop a virus I don't know but it must be an aid, after all why do Dr's & nurses wear masks when treating patients?

[blingo]

They are completely different masks Alfie.  Did the enforcement of wearing masks stop the third wave? No. In gib we have to wear masks in certain areas but not others. We have fared no better or worse than anywhere else. Conclusion... The masks made no difference.

[toshes mate]

It is a part of the medical profession's code 'to do the patient no harm', and the use of masks is professionally accepted in high risk of infection situations.  The risk of transmitting any coronavirus is largely unknown even in the current pandemic according to the WHO and we have had zoonotic coronaviruses circulating for a very much longer time than when they were first identified almost a century ago.  At one end of the spectrum of expert and/or political 'beliefs' an 'infected' surface may pose a risk whilst at the other end we can find those who suggest infections are almost certainly passed via coughs and sneezes in close proximity to others because only then is there sufficient viral load to cause an infection.   Who is right and who is wrong is, IMO, a bit of a lottery at the moment. 

[mrmicawbers]

I think the whole EU led by the Germans are politicising the AZ vaccine because they've  f..... up their whole vaccination programme.  The fact is you stand a better chance of blood clots if you smoke or are giving birth.  There may well be odd case but the risk is so small it's not worth worrying about.  I'm 80 and couldn't wait to get my first jab.  Both my wife and I had no ill affects whatsoever.  My second one is at the end of the month.  At the end of the day its a personal choice take it or leave it

You may get blod clots from smoking or giving birth but you won't get the extremely serious combination of blod clots, low platelet counts and internal bleeding. This is what they are finding with AZ patients (some of them have died) and there seems to be a connection. This is a very serious condition that has not been documented with Pfizer og any of the other vaccines. The risk still seems to be very low though.

wow. This post contains so many falsehoods. I work in Pharma. Firstly, they aren't "finding" this as you have said. In fact the opposite. Secondly there does not "seem to be a connection". We don't work with "seems" in pharma. We have clinical trials. These have shown there is no risk of blood clots. The amount of patients experiencing blood clots is much less prevalent than would be experienced in the general population.

ADMINS - This is a clear, clear spreading of false information which could put lives at risk by persuading others not to get the vaccine. The users post should be deleted

make you right Joe,if people want conspiracy theories they should stick to Facebook and the like.Seems to me some people would be happy stuck in a permanent lockdown situation.the Probably hate the thought of the rest of the population enjoying life again.Very sad lives they must live or not live.

[Montague]

Received my second Pfizer today :)

Got my first AZ jab today, very impressed with the set-up.  My wife requested the Pfizer version but was told they only had supplies to administer them for the second jab.  Can't say I'm fussed which I was given.

My father had AZ and said it was like a conveyer belt. Unlike Pfizer where you hang around with a cup of tea for 15 minutes incase you keel over and die!

Interesting - I've had the Pfizer one and had to wait 10 mins after before leaving (although no one policed this and it was up to you when you left)

Have a friend who lives in NL and he thinks their Govt has jumped at the chance of holding back the AZ vaccine as they had promised XXX millions of vaccinations by a certain date - they were way off hitting targets so will now use the AZ hold as the reason for not hitting the promised target delivery - no blame on their Govt then

[alfie]

They are completely different masks Alfie.  Did the enforcement of wearing masks stop the third wave? No. In gib we have to wear masks in certain areas but not others. We have fared no better or worse than anywhere else. Conclusion... The masks made no difference.

I completely understand but, if everyone were to wear a mask and it still spread then that is conclusive proof, but you have thousands of people who refuse to wear a mask, who will continue to spread the virus if they have it. Personally I wear a mask whenever I leave the house, as I have copd, diabetes, high BP, I just feel a little safer.

[Holders]

I wear a mask because I have CDO - to the uninitiated that's OCD but in alphabetical order.